mmmmmmmmm....beeeer

[Davidcv67]

I went to a 'Pain Management doctor' last week....quite the experience.

After signing a zillion waivers with regard to narcotics, oxycotin, giving my medicine to others etc. I got to talk to him. He had a very interesting perspective on things. I was really impressed with his knowledge of Marfans and other heart related issues. I guess I didnt expect that from him since his forte is pain management and not a doctor who specializes in other stuff. But I guess for what he does he needs to know a 'little about a lot'

Anyway to the mmmmmmm....beeeer part.

We got to the point where I was offering which medicines I take and I mentioned I drink a beer or 2 a night. He was very anti-beer for me. He said with my connective tissue disorder (Marfans) 1 or 2 beers could have more of a adverse effect on my liver than a normal person.

He suggested instead I come home and pop a Zanax! (actually I have alprazolam..but same dif)

He was very non-chalont about it. I thought 'benny's' were highly addictive...but he countered with "well your addicted to beer" I said "No I am not!" He said well you just told me you "had to have your beer every night" I guess he got me...so does really wanting a beer or 2 make one an alcoholic? I don't beat my wife or dog. I am very reliable at work, I never drink before 5 pm (unless there is football game or any other sport on or if I am boating or working on my basement or watching T.V. or going to a cook-out or raking the leaves)...other than that NEVER before 5.

So is this doc on track?

I tried this the other night but it put me to sleep at 7:00 pm. My wife said I should take the Xanax alone...I took it on top of a beer. Bad idea.


Dave

 

[Ross]

Hi Dave

I don't think that classifies as alcoholism. It could be a precursor of things to come in the future. I certainly wouldn't take the meds with the brew though. Believe it or not, I used to be a very heavy drinker- Alcoholic. I figure I've messed up my body enough and it's getting even with me now.

Wanting a beer or two is normal. Having to have the beer or two or more is alcoholic like. If you don't get your beer, how do you act about it?

 

[hensylee]

Anything you HAVE TO HAVE makes you addicted to it (like your everyday food). If you don't have beer, what is your reaction? You will be just as addicted to alprozam as alcohol, given time. I have taken allprozam for quite some time and feel it would be a real battle to stop. Ross, being on it a short time, found he got the shakes when he stopped it. Going cold turkey can be dangerous. If you are really serious about this, why not go online and explore further. We wouldn't want you falling down in years to come - There is thought that red wine is beneficial to hearts, taking one glass per day - however drs are warned not to advise patients to start if they don't already do it as it can lead to alcoholism. I am not an expert on this, of course, so others will come along and have their say, too. The very fact that you are asking shows that it has you thinking. Best - God bless Ann

 

[Kevin M]

These are all labels. An alcoholic seems to be a term that is thrown around quite loosely.

I do not drink everyday, but I do drink pretty much every weekend. I think I have alcoholic tendencies, but I wouldn't follow the classic definition of one as far as absolutely must have a drink at any given time.

We tend to put these labels on our habits. Depending on the situation, I could also be called a binge eater, sex addict, in need of anger management, among others.

I don't think you need the pressure of considering yourself a possible alcoholic. A couple of beers generally doesn't hurt a healthy person, but you no longer fit that criteria. It's interesting that the doctor would rather see you on prescription drugs than beer. I don't get that, but hey, I'm no doctor.

What do you get out of beer? You are not having enough to get a buzz going or use it as escapism in the classic sense. Is it just a relaxation ritual? If so, perhaps there are other ways you can achieve this? Sometimes a hobby, exercise or meditation can help immensely.

Anyway, I won't suggest you stop drinking beer because I love it myself and I'm not your doctor.

It would be interesting to look at why you drink it and what it does for you. Then, you can judge whether or not you are willing to change this habit to a more productive one or stay the course.
Kev

 

[Mara]

Dave-
Doesn't sound like it to me.

But..... all the drug and alcohol treatment counselors say you can be an alcoholic and only drink one drink a week, it's all about how you handle it. I guess you'll know when you quit the beer.

 

[Lorraine]

Hi Dave,

I have a problem with some people who don't drink or that is a doctor, calling someone who likes to have a couple of beers a night, an alcoholic! I don't get it! Can't someone just happen to like the taste of beer, just like someone liking lets say, cream soda, cappacino, or even plain ice water, without being labeled? I know I happen to like the taste of beer but I wouldn't go beserk if I didn't have any in the house for a month. I just happen to like the taste of beer. Just like I happen to like the taste of well water(most people don't). I really don't care for soda. I'm not a tea drinker anymore)being that I'm not sure which ones I can have. I use to drink herb tea all the time. I guess I just can't stand that we all automatically have to be labeled. I don't judge people that way, and I guess I expect others not to judge people that way either.

Kevin, you asked what Dave got out of having one or two beers? Now why couldn't it be that it quenched his thirst and tasted good, without it having to be that it gave him a buzz? Actually depending on how tired I am two beers could give me a buzz!

My doctor told me after I had valve surgery not to drink beer either but, unless I see a change from a liver panel blood test showing the start of a problem, I plan to continue to consume the beverage, I just so happen to like.

Before I go, I don't want anyone to get me wrong. I understand that alchoholism is a disease and many people don't even know they have it until the alcohol rules their life. I know all about it because i watched my step-mother go through it. It can be devastating! My whole thought is just surrounding the labeling because you have a couple of beers. That said I better go. Thanks!

 

[Jeffrey A]

I hate labels. I don't think that you are an alcoholic, and I don't think that a couple beers a night is that big of a deal. I think that when it gets to the point of having to have a beer just to keep "normal", it might be leading to a problem, but you are the one that looks in the mirror each day. You are the one that answers the bell.

On a personal note, I try not to mix alcohol with any drugs, especially the ones that say do not operate heavy machinery or may cause drowsiness. I have also found that since I started on the coumadin, alcohol reacts to me quicker. I got this big pitch in the hsopital about eating healthier, no alcohol, no salt, no smoking etc. I am eating healthier, I don't smoke, and I very rarely pick up the salt shaker, but I do have cocktails. My surgeon said the biggest fear he had with coumadin patients drinking was that if you got drunk, fell down and cut yourself, you could bleed out. I have not really had a problem here. My Cardio guy encouraged the red wine, but there also published reports that beer accomplishes the same thing. Remember there is a little irish in all of us, and I especially like Robs joke.

 

[Davidcv67]

I'm not a crook!

I'm not a crook!

Last night I had 1 beer. It was totally the habit/ritual of cracking open a frosty one after a hards days work. I caught a little buzz, I liked the way it tasted. I wanted it. I didn't need it though. (to the point that if I did not have it I would through my wife through the window) I don't get shakey or irritable.

A few times I tested myself to see if I could 'Stop' so I would go a week or a month to see how I reacted. Nothing really changed. I will say at times now If I am highly stressed out sitting in traffic I can't wait to get home and sit in my chair to relax with a cold one.

I like Kevin's thought since it fits my situation the best; it is a 'relaxation ritual'

My Dad was an alcholic so I think that is the reason I keep myself in check.

 

[hensylee]

Someone close to me is a recovering alcoholic. She was given a taste of beer at 6 mos old and she begged for more. At 3 she got into the Christmas bottle under the tree. She had been a very quiet child til then but she sure was giggly that night and had the best time. She grew up to be a roaring drunk and finally lost control but worked hard and got it under control. I believe that she is one of those born with the disease. One drink and she wouldn't stop til it was all gone or she passed out. She is now a successful woman and a tribute to the community. I believe that if it's in the family you have to watch out for it. Sounds like you have things under control, Dave and are certainly aware of what to look for. Awareness is the key. You don't sound much like an alcoholic to me. God bless

 

[Mara]

Dave
I just hope that it's good beer you're drinking and not putting yourself through this stress over some rot-gut like Bud.

I like beer, too. Can't tell the difference between a "good" wine and Boone's Farm. But, beer, now that's a different story.

If it makes you happy, go for it. Wasn't it Benjamin Franklin who said "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy"

Just keep an eye on it with your Marfan's.

 

[Creed3]

Hi Dave!
It doesn't sound to me like you have a problem right now, but it is good that you are aware that there may be a possability of a problem in the future. Especially since your father had trouble with alcohol. It is good to have a very supportive wife. Sometimes if you can't tell there is a problem, she may be able to notice a change in things. If a problem ever did occur, I'm sure the people closest to you would let you know and try to help. So enjoy your beer, but it is good to keep it in check.

Take Care!
Gail

 

[MarkU]

I gave up drinking beer after my surgery. I had been drinking about one six pack a week, most of it on the weekends while mindlessly watching sports on TV.

Even though both my cardiologist and surgeon both said it was okay to continue to use alcohol in moderation, I now limit myself to red wine, one or two glasses, and only with meals.

There is some history of alcoholism in my family, so I've always been a little nervous about overindulging. I guess I'm somewhat fearful of any inherited tendency that I might have.


Mark

 

[medtronic of borg]

Beer

Beer

And just how many of you ever thought about the possibility that your enjoying "Just a Drink or Two" played a role in getting heart disease? I'm a ACHDer I didn't bring on heart diseas by being stupid. I'm not into gluttony. By the way there have been deaths of people who have taken Xanax with beer. The liver can only process so many chemicals at the same time. It is kind of like sitting in a room with sixteen sterios on. You can hear them but not well, simply to much incoming.

 

[Rain]

Beer - - Cheers!!

Beer - - Cheers!!

Hey Lorraine,

In one of my infamous computer 'overhauls' I lost your email address. I'm still [email protected]

I wanted to ask you what I should remember to buy while I'm in Mexico. I remember I used to always buy vanilla. But don't remember all the other 'goodies' I used to make sure I got. We haven't been down there for quite a while.

And all the times we've been down there, we've never gone to a bull fight. We're thinking of going to one this time.. do you think it would be to traumatic for my nine year old daughter?? And where are they? The only one I know of is the one in Mazatlan on Sunday afternoons.

We're driving all the way to Puerto Valarta and then taking a boat to Yelapa.

How about everyone else? Got any ideas or opinions?? I'd love to hear what everyone thinks about it. I wouldn' t wanna mess with my daughter's head and I wouldn't wanna get back and rememeber that I forgot the case of Corona!! You gotta love those Coronas Mara?!!

Thanks,
Rain

 

[Mara]

Rain-
I like Corona, but I think the best Mexican beer is Pacifico. My brother in Tucson will say its Negra Modello.

I have to vote NO on the bullfight thing. The bull gets killed and pretty wacked up. I think it's too traumatic for me to see at 35, I would have freaked at 9. Plus, there's the fact that's it's really mean. what if the bull went freaky and gored the matador? Then your daughter would have to see the bull get abused and killed and the man get injured, too. It's a pretty gruesome event.

Those chimenea (sp) are cool. Luminaria, that's a good thing to bring back. Tequila is always appreciated. Silver jewelry.
Those are some of the things I bought last time I was in Mex. You could take orders for all your elderly neighbors and bring back cheap perscription drugs.

 

[MarkU]

medtronic,

Thanks for the cheerful thoughts. I assume they were well-intended, if not slightly judgemental. Didn't realize what a stupid glutton I was.

My bicuspid aortic valve was congenital and was first diagnosed when I was five years old, which was just a few years before I had my first drink. I was always told to expect it to give out in my mid-to-late 40's, which it did, right on schedule. Lucky me.

When I first read all the CYA legal disclaimers about Coumadin and alcohol, I was completely willing to give it up after my surgery. However, both my cardiologist and surgeon told me that it was not necessary as long as I used it in moderation, which I have. I trust their advice and guidance.

The only thing my doctors have prohibited are activities that require wearing a helmet (race car driving, skydiving, bungee jumping, etc.). This I have strictly complied with.

I usually take my Coumadin with water, but yes, I did take it once with a sip of Merlot.

Guess I like living on the edge too much.

Excuse me, but I need to go sit in the corner and listen to my stereo.

Mark

 

[Nancy]

I agree with Mara, that the bullfights are really mean. The whole object is man over animal, and the man is hiding a big knife under that cape, but prior to plunging the knife into the bull (and sometimes they don't kill it, they just hurt it), the picadors stab the animal with big barbs all over its back to weaken it. I also do believe they cinch up the animal's testicles to make it mean, and may also put some kind of irritant on it's anus to make it buck. It's bloody, gory and serves a useless purpose, which is the cruel death of a magnificent animal.

Never did understand the romance of it. I would hope that some aspects of civilization have gone beyond this kind of spectacle.

 

[Johnny Stephens]

Actually, borg, light intake of certain types of alcohol (red wine) has been shown to have beneficial effects for the heart. In fact I've recently seen mention on this board that one study even showed beer to have this effect.

With regard to your "stupid" and "gluttony" comments, as a person who has battled both a weight problem and the accompanying prejudice, I don't see those as any kind of constructive input for someone trying to work this problem out. Let's keep to the high road, please.

FWIW, I can't stand the taste of beer. It's just the way I'm wired, no morality judements are attached. Knowing myself, if I did like the taste of it, I would have a problem.

 

[Rain]

For real?? Yikes!!

For real?? Yikes!!

Hey Nancy... Have you seen a bull fight? Just curious.

We?ve drove way down in the heart of Mexico off and on all the boys lives. But we?ve never gone to a bull fight. Pretty much for the very reasons you mentioned. But you see, now the boys are 22 & 19... and thinking they might like to see what its really all about. Yes, I know they could go by themselves... but I don?t like separating the family when we?re down there. Sooo we probably won?t go... I haven?t talked to their father about it yet either... no tellin what his opinion might be.

It?s not like my kids haven?t seen an animal killed. They have... many different types of animals..... but not tortured.... that goes totally against everything they know and understand. The animals they have seen or helped kill were strictly for eating. In truth... if it?s as bad as you make it sound I honestly believe they would leave the place disgusted.

Sooooo....... that?s why I asked the question. I guess I better go read up on it.

Mara are you telling me you can get prescription drugs without a prescription there? If you can... wouldn?t you be afraid to take them? Hmm.... I have wondered if I should take some antibiotics with me... Ryan has an appt. with my cardio next Tuesday.. I?m gonna ask him about taking some with me.

I have brought back te kill ya .. worm and all. But last time we were down there they took the case of corona away from us. Grrrr.... Vergil decided the guy wanted to take it home and drink it, so he took it away from the guy and we poured every bottle out on the ground. lol It was hilarious!! REALLY made the guy mad... Whew! Looking back on it, I can?t believe we did that. lol

 

[Nancy]

I did see a couple of bullfights when I was a teenager, travelling in Mexico with my family. (I've been there several times, but not recently). There didn't seem to be such a social conscience about the suffering of animals at the time, at least I never heard anyone discussing it. I didn't like the bullfights then and wasn't impressed by the fancy matador posturing in front of the bull.

I hated the part when they cut off the bull's ear and presented it to some lady in the stands.

Well, aside from that, I always loved Mexico. I still love Mexican silver. Taxco is one of my favs. Nasty ride up there though. Not very good drivers in Mexico. They take lots of chances on those mountain roads.

Also better ask the doc about some Tourista medication. I think I got it every time I went, that was before Immodium.

Also look at the ingredients in your Mexican vanilla. Some of it contains Coumarin (not Coumadin, but related). I seem to remember a thread way back when on that.