Marijuana and Blood Thinners/Mechanical Valve

[Superman]

Warfarin is natural. It’s just highly refined and specifically dosed. I wouldn’t want it any other way.

One could munch on spoiled sweet clover high in coumarin, but I prefer knowing how much of a chemical I’m ingesting. Look up the history of all natural warfarin. It’s kind of interesting. Starts with cows bleeding to death.

 

[Tinabobina]

That’s nice to know...but it’s still frightening to know that I have to basically live in a bubble, or at least maybe the doctors try to instill that fear in you. If you drive a car...wear a life alert bracelet they say...if you have a nosebleed and it bleeds for longer than 10 minutes go to the ER...don’t have to much leafy greens or it can impact your INR....watch out for bruising, cuts....I feel like I have to live in this bubble. I’m only 35 and because of warfarin I have to change my entire lifestyle. I’m very grateful to be alive but I hate taking blood thinners

 

[Chuck C]

That’s nice to know...but it’s still frightening to know that I have to basically live in a bubble, or at least maybe the doctors try to instill that fear in you. If you drive a car...wear a life alert bracelet they say...if you have a nosebleed and it bleeds for longer than 10 minutes go to the ER...don’t have to much leafy greens or it can impact your INR....watch out for bruising, cuts....I feel like I have to live in this bubble. I’m only 35 and because of warfarin I have to change my entire lifestyle. I’m very grateful to be alive but I hate taking blood thinners

Tina,
I would recommend that you check out this thread. Pellicle is an expert at INR management and the thread dispels many of the myths about life on warfarin:

https://www.valvereplacement.org/threads/my-self-management-results-for-2020.887821/

 

[Superman]

That’s nice to know...but it’s still frightening to know that I have to basically live in a bubble, or at least maybe the doctors try to instill that fear in you. If you drive a car...wear a life alert bracelet they say...if you have a nosebleed and it bleeds for longer than 10 minutes go to the ER...don’t have to much leafy greens or it can impact your INR....watch out for bruising, cuts....I feel like I have to live in this bubble. I’m only 35 and because of warfarin I have to change my entire lifestyle. I’m very grateful to be alive but I hate taking blood thinners

I’ve been on warfarin since I was 17. I don’t think about it. I used to play pick up basketball. Mountain biking. Hiking. I had a salad for lunch today. Probably will tomorrow as well. I’m married and have five awesome kids (all since being on warfarin, since I was in high school when I started).

Im 48 now. My wife and I are planning a rim to rim Grand Canyon hike next year before I turn 50.

Eat more leafy greens. Dose the diet. I’ve been on this stuff over 30 years. Tell me something you think you have to stop and I’ll tell you if I still do it.

I shave with a regular razor (electric irritates my skin). I drove solo 15 hours to Boston with just a six pack of coke and a couple sandwiches and cassette tapes to keep me company. Through Canada and before cell phones and no home testing in my early 20’s. Just this weekend I was using power tools. Drilling holes and cutting wood with a mitre saw. Never thought about being on warfarin. Except when I first woke up and took it with my orange juice.

 

[Chuck C]

I’ve been on warfarin since I was 17. I don’t think about it. I used to play pick up basketball. Mountain biking. Hiking. I had a salad for lunch today. Probably will tomorrow as well. I’m married and have five awesome kids (all since being on warfarin, since I was in high school when I started).

Im 48 now. My wife and I are planning a rim to rim Grand Canyon hike next year before I turn 50.

Eat more leafy greens. Dose the diet. I’ve been on this stuff over 30 years. Tell me something you think you have to stop and I’ll tell you if I still do it.

I shave with a regular razor (electric irritates my skin). I drove solo 15 hours to Boston with just a six pack of coke and a couple sandwiches and cassette tapes to keep me company. Through Canada and before cell phones and no home testing in my early 20’s. Just this weekend I was using power tools. Drilling holes and cutting wood with a mitre saw. Never thought about being on warfarin. Except when I first woke up and took it with my orange juice.

" I’m married and have five awesome kids (all since being on warfarin, "

So much for the rumors about warfarin making you impotent!

 

[pellicle]

but it’s still frightening to know that I have to basically live in a bubble

ok, I'll bite ... why do you have to live in a bubble?

 

[pellicle]

I'm not sure if we have a warfarin myths page ...

" I’m married and have five awesome kids (all since being on warfarin, "

So much for the rumors about warfarin making you impotent!

closest I could find:
https://www.valvereplacement.org/threads/warfarin-causes-dementia.887582/post-898206

 

[pellicle]

Oh. I meant to post this here to counter the "thousands of times less harmful than tobacco"

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1125867/
One of my old University colleagues has now deep mental health issues which are directly attributable to smoking pot ... he's not just a casual user ... so I'll look forward to all the detailed studies exonerating this toxic weed.

I don't smoke anything.

Eat healthy live healthy and treat your body like you can't buy spare parts.

 

[pellicle]

P.S. Regarding the dangers of smoking, from what I understand cigarettes are millions of times more hazardous to your health than smoking pot.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1125867/
nope

 

[pellicle]

Everyone is different. There are many people who are regular marijuana users who are healthy and live a healthy and active lifestyle.

show me the evidence of long term use (and I mean decades) and I'll be very interested to read that.

I've yet to see anything to support that (and I'm no sheltered kiddie)

 

[pellicle]

Pellicle is an

there's no "blush" icon

I'd prefer to just call myself "well read"

 

[slipkid]

That’s nice to know...but it’s still frightening to know that I have to basically live in a bubble, or at least maybe the doctors try to instill that fear in you. If you drive a car...wear a life alert bracelet they say...if you have a nosebleed and it bleeds for longer than 10 minutes go to the ER...don’t have to much leafy greens or it can impact your INR....watch out for bruising, cuts....I feel like I have to live in this bubble. I’m only 35 and because of warfarin I have to change my entire lifestyle. I’m very grateful to be alive but I hate taking blood thinners

I wouldn't worry 'bout it. Put it out of your mind. Live your life. Just stay on top of testing your INR and find the sweet spot of the doses to stay in range. Try to eat a diet that weekly stays pretty even as far as leafy vegs go so your INR does not get too affected. It can be a pain with minor cuts bleeding longer but not a big deal, at least not for me so far.

Be careful if banging your head real hard, especially if you get knocked out with a concussion, you may need to get checked out to make sure there is no bleeding in there that can cause probs.

Other than not going for any motorcycle rides I didn't really change that much of my lifestyle. OK, I am older and no longer doing things like playing football or any contact sports like that, if I was younger I guess I would have to stop that stuff.

I too hate taking warfarin (ANY pills at all). Makes me feel old, like my parents chained to their meds back in the day. Got used to it as best I can though. You will too.

 

[pellicle]

I too hate taking warfarin (ANY pills at all). Makes me feel old, like my parents chained

you have just hit upon a very profound and very "self honest" answer there. This is something I felt in an unspoken way as an observation of life. I know I'm old when I start taking pills. This is however not really accurate or even the whole truth.

As a society we give everyone "events" to mark things, Christenings, 21st Birthdays, weddings. All sorts of "coming of age things" to celebrate (for the parents too) that kids are taking steps.

We do however reject anything inferred as negative (even if natural).

I recall feeling this way many times in the years before I was on warfarin (and pretty much just as an observation of those older people around me. But its not always age and can be from other issues (depression comes to mind).

I recall that when I started down the path of warfarin I felt some level of sadness that my life had changed, that I was now no longer a free agent and had become dependent on something that society provided for me. I had imagined that I was entirely able to survive on my own ... something I'd done in survival training and something I'd done for a time whenever I went on extended hikes (we call them bush walks in Australia). I fancied myself as someone who was self sufficient and could survive in a SHTF post societal fall world. Being on warfarin however took that fantasy away from me.

Fantasy? Well yes, I began thinking of it and realised that over time my boots would wear out, as would my clothes, I'd have no sun screen, basics like sugar and flour would be impossible to find.

We are all interlinked something I knew in a different room of my brain when discussing fantasy notions with others who wanted to move "off grid" and be "self sufficient" (eg, where are you getting your solar panels from? The batteries?? ...)

It's a change, but then you are chained to food and water and in reality to society. We just allow a range of movement.

As you may have seen I've done a lot of travelling post warfarin and have taken my meter with me. I've been able to take 30 days worth of "supplies" in a small bottle that costs about $10

I strongly recommend you read Jordan Petersons new book 12 Rules for Life ... it will guide you down further revelations (I recommend this indeed to all readers here).

As I was saying to @tezza yesterday, it's just mostly a psychological barrier.

 

[tom in MO]

Warfarin is natural. It’s just highly refined and specifically dosed. I wouldn’t want it any other way.

One could munch on spoiled sweet clover high in coumarin, but I prefer knowing how much of a chemical I’m ingesting. Look up the history of all natural warfarin. It’s kind of interesting. Starts with cows bleeding to death.

Warfarin does not exist in nature. The class of chemicals it belongs in was discovered in nature. Karl Link at the University of Wisconsin developed it.

 

[Superman]

Warfarin does not exist in nature. The class of chemicals it belongs in was discovered in nature. Karl Link at the University of Wisconsin developed it.

Everything exists in nature. However many things require a great deal of refinement and processing.

I only use organic plastic refined from all natural crude oil. Made with real pre-historic plants so you know it’s good!

 

[pellicle]

Everything exists in nature

not exactly everyting...

warning: non chemistry nerds quit here ...

While not everything, most drugs certainly came from there at the beginning. My understanding is that warfarin is such a drug. We can not extract it, but its progenitor is naturally produced by a fungus thus (unlike say Americium) at least that is found in nature.

I believe that Warfarin (as we take it) is actually synthetic. Its progenitor was discovered:

​

In the early 1920s, there was an outbreak of a previously unrecognized cattle disease in the northern United States and Canada. Cattle were haemorrhaging after minor procedures, and on some occasions spontaneously.[84] For example, 21 out of 22 cows died after dehorning, and 12 out of 25 bulls died after castration. All of these animals had bled to death.[85]​

...​

​

The identity of the anticoagulant substance in spoiled sweet clover remained a mystery until 1940. In 1933 Karl Paul Link and his lab of chemists working at the University of Wisconsin set out to isolate and characterize the haemorrhagic agent from the spoiled hay.[84] It took five years before Link's student Harold A. Campbell recovered 6 mg of crystalline anticoagulant. Next, Link's student Mark A. Stahmann took over the project and initiated a large-scale extraction,​

​

That anticoagulant wasn't warfarin per se. and now we make it (in for example) this way

https://www.ch.ic.ac.uk/local/projects/McIntosh/Synthesis.html

Racemic Warfarin Synthesis:

The usual synthetic route for racemic Warfarin involves a base/acid catalysed Michael condensation reaction of 4-hydroxycoumarin with benzalacetone. These reactants are either refluxed in water for approximately 4-8 hours or refluxed with pyridine which gives a saturated yield. The mechanism is shown below:

 

[almost_hectic]

I thought I read that warfarin was discovered as a result of cows that had ingested moldy clover and bled to death as a result. That discovery was what led to its use as rat poison.

 

[tom in MO]

The cows led to a discovery of a class of compounds 4-hydroxycoumarins.

 

[Yoel]

I completely disagree. CBD oil is beneficial when used for medical purposes. When I was diagnosed with clinical depression, this was quite helpful. But, and this is a major but, when I say medicinal marijuana and CBD oil, I don't mean you should use it on your own and think you're doing a wonderful thing; you should see a doctor first and then figure out how, when, and for how long you'll use it. You can recommend this location to your doctor, cbdhandle.com. You can acquire high-quality CBD oil at a reasonable price here. That's fantastic if your country allows it. Best of luck with that!

 

[RobThatsMe]

Hi Everyone,
Here is my own personnel experience with how pot, gummies, THC, , in other words...the chemical in these that effects you when ingested.
Using it raises my heart rate, even though you may feel calm and relaxed, the drug does elevate your heart rate. So,, if you have a mechanical heart valve, and have occasional A-fib, or A-Flutter issues, using these drugs may trigger an a-Fib, or A-Flutter event.
I have been home testing since March of 2000, and have never noticed any effect on my INR levels, but have experienced on many occasions, that I had a A-Fib event. Anyway, as I mentioned, this is my experience with the topic at hand.
So if you have a mechanical heart valve, and take blood pressure meds, or Beta Blockers, it would be something to watch.
Cheers,
Rob