Kidney Stones & Coumadin!

[pstarr]

Has anyone who is taking Coumadin ever had Lithotripsy to get rid of kidney stones? The urologist I have wanted me to stop my Coumadin a week before the procedure and another urologist said 3-4 days. My concern is this: If I'm having Lithotripsy why would I need to stop the Coumadin at all since they won't be "cutting" me. My cardiologist said that I may bruise but I won't bleed. I'm scared to death of being off the Coumadin that long.
HELP!!
Peggy

 

[sue943]

I have had lithotripsy, it gave me endocarditis after my second of three treatments. I bled from that session for several days and was NOT on warfarin at the time. The lithotripsy was the cause of all my problems.

I have another kidney stone now, I am seeing my cardiologist next month and will be asking him what he wants me to do about it. I don't think it will be lithotripsy but whatever it is I am going to have massive antibiotic cover that's for sure! I suspect I will be taken off warfarin and hospitalised on a heparin drip when it happens.

 

[Dina]

I have had lithotripsy, it gave me endocarditis after my second of three treatments. I bled from that session for several days and was NOT on warfarin at the time. The lithotripsy was the cause of all my problems.

I have another kidney stone now, I am seeing my cardiologist next month and will be asking him what he wants me to do about it. I don't think it will be lithotripsy but whatever it is I am going to have massive antibiotic cover that's for sure! I suspect I will be taken off warfarin and hospitalised on a heparin drip when it happens.

Wow! Did they give you antibiotics when you began to bleed post-lithotripsy?
Did you develop peritonitis or septicemia? With my first bout of endocarditis
I was diagnosed very late too and was fully septic with osteomyelitis by the time
they figured it out. Its something I have had trouble forgiving,even now.
OR esp now.

Peggy- Aren't they going to bridge you with Lovenox? That way you will only
be 'uncovered' for a few hours(8-12hours I think)

 

[ALCapshaw2]

Peggy,

Ask your Cardiologist about using Bridging Therapy (using Lovenox injections at home or a Heparin Drip in Hospital) to protect you before and after the procedure while you are Off Coumadin.

The usual procedure is to Stop Coumadin, Start Lovenox (or Heparin) the next day until 24 hours (sometimes only 12 hours) before the procedure. After the procedure, resume taking Coumadin. Bridging may or may not be resumed After the procedure. There is a Balancing Act between Risk of Bleeding vs. Risk of Clot Formation / Stroke. Some of our members have had Bleeding Issues if Lovenox is started too soon. It may be wise to wait 24 to 48 hours after the procedure depending on your Doctor's assessment of the Bleeding Risk.

Bottom Line: Have your Cardiologist and whoever is performing the procedure Confer and reach an agreement on how to handle the transition / Bridging.

'AL Capshaw'

 

[pstarr]

Posing another lithotripsy question!

Posing another lithotripsy question!

Thanks Sue for the info and now I'd like anyone else who has had lithotriipsy and had a bad experience. I don't want to sound ghoulish but if the success rate is lower going in to retrieve the stone instead of lithotripsy then I may change my plans.
THANKS ALL!

 

[pstarr]

I'm cancelling

I'm cancelling

the lithotripsy. I'm just too uncertain about having it done and perhaps getting something else or damaging the kidney. I didn't want surgery but this has me scared. I appreciate all the feedback I'm getting, especially you "AL" & "SUE". You folks are great. Thanks
Peggy

 

[Ross]

If you need it, you need it. There is no reason they cannot bridge you with either Lovenox or Heparin. Talk to them about it.

 

[TeresaCW]

I had lithotrypsy years before I was on warfarin. I'm not posting to give any advice, just to share my experience. After lithotrypsy I had a lot of bleeding for maybe two weeks. I passed a lot of granular stuff left over after the stone was blasted to pieces and it caused soreness inside and on its way out. I also had something called a J-stent in my bladder to help drainage, which may also have aggravated some of the soreness, I'm not sure, but it felt a lot more comfortable once it was removed. I hated everything to do with lithotrypsy - far more than other ops I've had. BUT I'm prone to kidney stones and have experienced many serious urinary tract infections and associated renal colic because the stones harbour bacteria like hungry sponges. So I'd opt for lithotrypsy over bacteria-infested kidney stones any time.

 

[ALCapshaw2]

I had lithotrypsy years before I was on warfarin. I'm not posting to give any advice, just to share my experience. After lithotrypsy I had a lot of bleeding for maybe two weeks. I passed a lot of granular stuff left over after the stone was blasted to pieces and it caused soreness inside and on its way out. I also had something called a J-stent in my bladder to help drainage, which may also have aggravated some of the soreness, I'm not sure, but it felt a lot more comfortable once it was removed. I hated everything to do with lithotrypsy - far more than other ops I've had. BUT I'm prone to kidney stones and have experienced many serious urinary tract infections and associated renal colic because the stones harbour bacteria like hungry sponges. So I'd opt for lithotrypsy over bacteria-infested kidney stones any time.

Do you drink LOTS of Water to keep hydrated?
(This helps minimize the occurance of Kidney Stones)

Does your Water contain lots of Minerals?

If so, use a Water Filter for your drinking / cooking water.

In the USA, Water Pitchers with BRITA Filters can be purchased as many retail stores. These filters have tested similar to Very Expensive Home Filtration Systems (from a personal observation of such a test).

'AL Capshaw'

 

[ALCapshaw2]

Peggy -

Did your Urologist tell you why he wanted to do a Lithotripsy as opposed to simply going 'up there' and retrieving the Kidney Stone?

It sounds like your Doctors may need to confer as to the best procedure given your circumstances (being anticoagulated). Has your Primary Care Physician been involved in this decision? Coordinating Care is one his responsibilities.

'AL Capshaw'

 

[sue943]

OHS seems to make mine disappear, and my stones were large uric acid ones. Before surgery I had them, three weeks later when I was scanned they had gone.

 

[Dina]

Do you drink LOTS of Water to keep hydrated?
(This helps minimize the occurance of Kidney Stones)

Does your Water contain lots of Minerals?

If so, use a Water Filter for your drinking / cooking water.

In the USA, Water Pitchers with BRITA Filters can be purchased as many retail stores. These filters have tested similar to Very Expensive Home Filtration Systems (from a personal observation of such a test).

'AL Capshaw'

Yes and its also good to avoid grapefruit juice,high vit C and high D in your diet. It used
to be that we were taught just the opposite and was told to drink high acidity- its amazing the way health guidelines and even what nurses/doctors are taught from year to year change.


Al- I use the brita pitcher, but the Pur on the faucette,So in effect I am double filtering,do you know about Pur,is it as good?

 

[olefin]

I use the brita pitcher, but the Pur on the faucette,So in effect I am double filtering,do you know about Pur,is it as good

If you want real water purification that produces pure water, install an under sink Reverse Osmosis system. Not all that expensive if one does their own installation and upkeep.

I installed us in a under sink RO system while we lived in TX. It supplied drinking water and water to the ice maker. The city water had a salty flat taste and the RO unit is the only way to remove salt other than distillation.

 

[Dina]

If you want real water purification that produces pure water, install an under sink Reverse Osmosis system. Not all that expensive if one does their own installation and upkeep.

I installed us in a under sink RO system while we lived in TX. It supplied drinking water and water to the ice maker. The city water had a salty flat taste and the RO unit is the only way to remove salt other than distillation.

Thanks ,I'll check into it. Since our plumbing is bad-very

 

[Lynlw]

Yes and its also good to avoid grapefruit juice,high vit C and high D in your diet. It used
to be that we were taught just the opposite and was told to drink high acidity- its amazing the way health guidelines and even what nurses/doctors are taught from year to year change.


Al- I use the brita pitcher, but the Pur on the faucette,So in effect I am double filtering,do you know about Pur,is it as good?

We have Zero water pitchers, they actually come with a little meter to measure the water (well the set I got did) before that we had Pur when I got the Zero I measured the PUR water and there was alot of difference. (zero much better) It IS heavier because of the bigger filter, but has a thing (spout) at the bottom to pour water instead of using the lid.

Zero Claims "ZeroWater® is the ONLY filtered water that meets FDA definition for purified bottled water.*" http://www.zerowater.com/Main.aspx

 

[ALCapshaw2]

Interesting Information on the PUR and Zero Water Filters.

I am not familiar with them.

All I can personally attest to is that I have NOT had any more Kidney Stones after implementing the Brita Filtered Pitchers for Drinking / Cooking / Ice Water and that has been for several years now.

 

[Lynlw]

Interesting Information on the PUR and Zero Water Filters.

I am not familiar with them.

All I can personally attest to is that I have NOT had any more Kidney Stones after implementing the Brita Filtered Pitchers for Drinking / Cooking / Ice Water and that has been for several years now.

They're pretty new, you probably don't know of them, because unlike me you actually have a life, so aren't adddicted to qvc
I like that they have a filter recycle program, if you send them the old filter the recycyle it and send a small coupoun for filters to offset the shipping

 

[sue943]

There are a number of different stones so you need to know the sort you have, water filtering isn't going to stop some types of stone. As I said, mine are uric acid and filtering water won't stop those forming.#

I only drink Brita filtered water and have grown new ones.

 

[TeresaCW]

Do you drink LOTS of Water to keep hydrated?
(This helps minimize the occurance of Kidney Stones)

Does your Water contain lots of Minerals?

If so, use a Water Filter for your drinking / cooking water.

'AL Capshaw'

Yes, I live in an area that has very 'hard' water. Just leaving an upturned washed glass to drain away leaves a calcified ring at the sink. I go through phases of using Brita water filters, but somehow I get out of the habit for long stretches. I don't actually enjoy drinking water or cold drinks generally, it seems to give me acid reflux. I drink a lot of tea and coffee though, usually decaff, mostly at work, which is also in a hard water area. I never related the kidney stones to the hard water, but it makes sense! Now you've drawn it to my attention again, I'll buy some more filters tomorrow....

 

[pstarr]

Cancelled procedure

Cancelled procedure

First, I cancelled the Lithotripsy because there was no communication between the urologist & my cardiologist. My cardiologist called the urologist & they didn'st return the call. I phoned the urologist in the morning go no reply so I called the scheduler & left a message & SHE never called me back. When she did-4 hours later I cancelled & am planning on writing a scathing letter to the urologist & his staff for the negligence. In the meantime I have come across something holistic that guarantees (or your money back) to get rid of stones naturally therefore I'm going to try it. At this point I have NOTHING to lose except the stone. If it doesn't I'm going back to the second urologist I saw & liked.

Second our water here in Vegas is AWFUL! VERY hard. We get bottled water except I make ice cubes with the tap water (DUH) I'm going to start using bottled to make the cubes also. As recommended, I'll stay away from grapefruit & oranges with the acid and YES I drink LOTS & LOTS of water which kind of surprised me when I found out I have this size stone. I've always passed the other ones I've had.

My cardiologist told me to take double the dose of Coumadin for 2 days and then my normal dosage. That's the main thing that truly bothered me when I went off the Coumadin is having a stroke. Now I'm happy and will give my "natural" method a try.

Thanks to everyone for their advice. My valve thanks you too!!!:>)
Peggy