Update & Choices - This is Difficult

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My husband had his bicuspid aortic valve replaced with a mechanical valve 4 years ago. He will be 56 in November. He hunts,fishes,uses a chainsaw to cut our firewood,does all our carpentary work and works 8-12 hours a day in an industrial warehouse as a Maintenance mechanic. The coumadin has not been a big issue and the ticking is barely noticeable to us now. But,when a new mechanic starts at work they sometimes ask why his watch is so loud. I know there is no quarantee he may not need surgery again at some point we feel at peace with his choice for a mechanical. This was what his doctor suggested and this is what we went with.
 
My son is waiting for his 2nd OHS,we have been told that it has to be machanical, althow im not sure why, so will ask at the next check-up, because he is so young he will need it replaced again anyway, or so where lead to believe, because they wont be able to fit a adult size. Iam releived in a way because we dont have to make a choice, i think that would be a really difficult thing to choose. Good luck with your decition and all the best Paula x
 
I just wanted to praise Bob H. for his fabulous summary of the risks involved with tissue vs. mechanical - very balanced and clear. Thanks!

I am the same age as Arc Welder and had my aortic valve replaced two weeks ago with a bovine stented valve. Most everything has already been covered in this thread but I wanted to add a note about the importance of thinking about your own personality style when making this difficult decision. I really agree that either choice can be the correct one, but much of it depends upon who you are as a person. Myself, I do very well in a crisis but have a horror of routine and don't handle every day stress all that well. As a result, I decided to accept having OHS every 10 - 15 years to avoid the daily risks and stress associated with Coumadin.

As it turns out, the surgery really wasn't that bad - not much pain, I was walking the next day and, except for being tired and a little sore, am already back to my old self. And, assuming I get to have my next surgery at the Cleveland Clinic again, the risks involved only go up very slightly (from 1% to under 2% for fatality, similiar increases in risk of stroke, congnitive loss, etc.) But, again, I wouldn't recommend this choice for everyone. It just was the right one for me.

I wish you the best of luck and am confident you will make the choice that is right for you. Kate
 
Kate said:
I just wanted to praise Bob H. for his fabulous summary of the risks involved with tissue vs. mechanical - very balanced and clear. Thanks!
humble.gif
Since Bob isn't on to post this himself. :D
 
Bob - WOW
Thanks for taking the time to do such a thorough assessment.
 
I think we should hang on to Bob's analysis and information for future threads. It states all sides very clearly.
 
geebee said:
I think we should hang on to Bob's analysis and information for future threads. It states all sides very clearly.

DITTO THAT :)
 
Yep, what Bob said :) .

Jim went for the mechanical valve. He's also an engineer, and was impressed by the capabilities of the valve his surgeon recommended. He was also offered the choice of a tissue valve (with the down-side of definite re-ops in the future) or the Ross (which involved messing with a perfectly healthy valve - great if it works but not if anything goes wrong). There was no way he could imagine choosing to go through OHS again if at all possible, either before he'd been through it or having experienced it. But I think his recovery was a little longer than some around the same age have experienced. Unfortunately there's no way of knowing until after you've been through it yourself whether you think you can handle it again!

Whatever you choose, you'll be getting a valve that works PROPERLY! So just go with what you feel is right and be happy with your choice.

Gemma.
 
Ross Procedure

Ross Procedure

Thought this was worth sharing.
New York Daily News
Up close and surgical
By STEVE DITLEA
Wednesday, September 28th, 2005

When Manhattanite Jennifer Robbins was told she needed a heart-valve replacement, she didn't know much about the toughest yet most permanent surgery for her condition: the Ross procedure. So she hurried over to an operating room at Beth Israel Medical Center to see the operation performed by her surgeon, Dr. Paul Stelzer. Reassured, she went ahead with the surgery a month later in the same OR.
Robbins' initial visit wasn't an actual one. Getting a prospective patient, let alone anyone not directly involved in surgery, into a New York City hospital operating room would require permission from the patient under the knife, doctors and hospital administrators.

Instead, Robbins' presence was virtual, via a one-hour video of the operation originally performed live on the Web in October 2004, archived and available 2-4/7 at OR-live.com. It's one of 205 recently shot videos of surgical procedures at the site, accessible for free.

UNPRECEDENTED ACCESS

For fans of "ER" on broadcast television and OR reality shows on the Discovery and Learning Channel cable networks, seeing what goes on within the sterile zone may not seem so novel. Yet the three-year-old OR-live site offers unprecedented access to some of the nation's top operating rooms for patients and families faced with crucial medical decisions.

"It put my mind at ease to see how comfortable Dr. Stelzer looked during the operation," Robbins recalled a few weeks after her own successful surgery. Also reassuring for Robbins, a technical designer in the garment industry, was the skilled suturing in the video: "I appreciated the stitching and the cutting," she said.

At age 40, Robbins was an ideal candidate for replacement of her own failing heart valve with one from the other side of her heart, which was in turn replaced with a valve from a human cadaver. The Ross procedure, which puts the patient on a heart-lung machine for much longer than a simpler mechanical or pig valve replacement, results in a repair that can last a lifetime (instead of 10 to 20 years for more common replacements - and without their need for anti-coagulant drugs).

AN INEXPENSIVE SHOOT

Only a few cardiac surgeons in New York or elsewhere offer the procedure. "It's my Mercedes-Benz option for isolated aortic valve disease in younger adult patients," explained Stelzer, who has been performing the difficult operation since 1987. To promote his expertise among referring doctors and potential patients around the world, Beth Israel's marketing department paid the $35,000 cost of producing, Webcasting and archiving the video by OR-live's parent company, slp3D Inc. of West Hartford, Conn.

Shooting surgery live is expensive, involving three cameras in the operating room and one covering the Webcast host, usually a medical colleague, plus four technicians handling multimedia concerns. In some cases, the tab for a video is picked up by makers of the device or by ug manufacturers. To date, some of OR-live's archived videos have been accessed by more than 25,000 visitors.

A replay of "Unique Aortic Valve Replacement for Younger Patients" (despite its dull title) proved compelling viewing. This was Stelzer's 375th Ross procedure. (Jennifer Robbins' was No. 382.) On screen, the 58-year-old surgeon exuded the calm of an airline pilot in the eye of a hurricane. With a stilled heart beneath his hands, he pointed out wonders of anatomy and tricks of the trade (a replacement valve is healthy if it holds water squirted into it).

Amid the painstaking work of reconstructing a human heart, he even found time for some humor; asked if there was any danger of dying during the operation, he responded, "Me, or the patient?" He turned dead serious when discussing the vital math of surgical experience with this procedure: "I lost three out of my first 30 patients, three more out of the next 200, and I haven't lost anybody since 1998,%" he said.

A little too much information? Apparently not, judging from the 4-to-1 ratio of non-professionals to health professionals accessing OR-live's Webcasts and archived videos. Peter Gailey, slp3D executive vice president for business development, noted that the site's original audience was supposed to be mostly doctors. "The big 'A-ha' for us was how well embraced this has been by the patient population," he says.

DEMYSTIFYING THE PROCESS

From cardiovascular surgery to urology, endocrinology to radiology, OR-live is evolving into an online video encyclopedia of 21st-century medical procedures, accessible to anyone with a Net connection and a mouse.

"This demystifies the operating room," said Eve-Marie Lacroix, chief of the public service division for the U.S. National Library of Medicine (part of the National Institutes of Health), which has added OR-live videos and live Webcasts to the resources on its popular patient-oriented site, MedlinePlus.gov. "It's not just patients before their surgery. Patients who've had surgery can finally understand what they had."

As for Robbins, recovering from her operation and without new episodes of "ER" to watch on TV, she began browsing OR-live again. "Now I'm interested in seeing other procedures that people I know have had," she said.
 
Great post, Bob......Arc..You and your wife keep reading..making notes, ect.. Being a pain wimp..not to worry..The hospital staff will make sure you are not in pain after your surgery..They want you..up and walking the halls shortly after surgery..Gets the nasty drugs out of your body...that they gave you during the surgery...the more you walk, the better you feel.Hospital stay is only 4-5 days..so, you will have to go home and continue to walk..First in the house and maybe the 2nd week outside a tad..Build it up..day by day..week by week...Most feel pretty good by the 6th week... NOT enough to drive your RV.. :p Unless, the wife drives..you may need to park it until next spring.........I take coumadin..no big deal..just have to take a pill everyday..If, you do decide to go Mech..try to look into getting a Protime......That way, you can still travel and if you are worried about your INR range..you can test it on the road. Once you stay in range..you only have to test maybe every 3-4 weeks. I think that you are still young enough, if you go tissue, you will have family around the 2nd time to help out.. and YES..you will need someone home with you the first few weeks..You will feel too weak to cook, ect..and will need help with meds, water, going to bathroom, ect.But, NO pain..just weak.. This is MAJOR surgery..and takes a long time..for those cells, muscles, ect. to fall back into place. :D We will be here to support you on any decision you make..and when you come home...just ask away..for any problems..post-op...Bonnie
 
Ross Procedure Considerations

Ross Procedure Considerations

Chilihead has pointed out an obvious flaw in this thread, inthat we haven't discussed the Ross Procedure. This is a procedure that replaces your faulty aortic valve with your nearly identical pulmonary valve, and usually places a homograft (from a human donor) in the less-demanding pulmonary valve position.

When it is successful, the Ross Procedure is the gold standard for aortic valve replacement, offering the only possibility of one-time valve surgery that produces lifelong, living-tissue repair without drugs.

A Ross-type procedure has also been tried in very limited numbers on the mitral valve, with mixed results.

One difficulty with the Ross Procedure is developing a feel for when it is appropriate. From postings during the last year, it appears that some of the surgeons who perform them are also unsure when it is a good risk. This is a poignant reason to seek out a highly experienced surgeon for the Ross procedure, who has years of successful patients in his wake. If you want to do it, look for a Stelzer.

There are some things that can make a Ross Procedure fail over the short term (less than ten years). I believe these are not due to poor surgery or a failure of the procedure itself, but of the diagnosis instead. This is important, because a failed Ross Procedure leaves the heart more damaged than more traditional surgeries do.

I believe that the cardiologist and the surgeon must fully understand the cause of the surgery candidate's valve disease, and whether it is a static or progressive problem. My personal observations and assumptions from posts and articles are that the cardiologist and surgeon must have a high degree of certainty that there is not a tendency toward aneurism; that other valves are not deteriorating as well, which may require later replacement or repair; and that the patient is not developing myxomatous (spongy) tissue as part of a bicuspid aortic syndrome, as the valve tissue itself will fail.

They must also stabilize the aortic root, if there is any chance that it will grow or deform.

These types of issues were evident in most of the failed Ross procedures.

I don't know the current, long-term success rate for Ross procedures, but it is certainly better than 50%, and I will edit the number here into this posting, if someone will provide it from a good source. I offer this because I note that I have discussed reasons for failure, but not much about the positive side of successes. It really is a beautiful thing when it is well done.

The aortic valve, being your own tissue, roots itself and continues to thrive as your own, living tissue. However, in many cases, there is a fairly strong reaction to the pulmonary homograft in the short term, and just as it starts to look quite bad, the response fizzles out and the valve settles down to long-term normalcy. This is common enough that it is considered a normal course of events, and some surgeons even feel it is a good sign for long-term success of the pulmonary homograft.

The homograft pulmonary valve can fail due to autoimmune reactions to it, or it can slowly close up over time, if the person lives a very long life. But slow failure of the pulmonary valve is not as severe an issue as an aortic or mitral valve, and its surgery is considered less difficult and less dangerous (although it certainly wouldn't seem that way to someone who is having it). It's also under trials for replacement via catheter. As it's under far less pressure than the aortic valve, it's a far better candidate for catheter-placed valves in their current state of development.

Best wishes,
 
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Arc,

If you take anything away from here, let it be that when you have made a choice, it will be the right one for you.

You can see this type of thread is the one that generates a ton of responses. Keep searching previous articles and print them out. Take them to the Dr. with you and discuss them. See another Dr. if your able and get THEIR opinion. When you think you've heard enough, make your choice and thank God you live in a time where you HAVE a choice.

I turn 42 in December and had my surgery in October of 03'. I've been a member of the local fire department for over 16 years and the department at my day job, a refinery, for 9 years. I still roll out of bed at God knows what time, making calls. I haven't missed a beat after recovering from my surgery. I went with a Ross Procedure. I was on the table 7 1/2 hours and on the pump for 4 of them. Other procedures probably would have been quicker or easier, but I went the way I did cause it felt right to me after talking with several Dr.'s. Will I ever have to go through another surgery? I don't know ... neither does anyone else. If I do, I'll weigh it all out again and make a choice.

Bottom line ... once you have your surgery, it's in God's hands. Nobody here ever received a written guarantee with the valve they chose. As we're all aware, guarantee's aren't part of life.

You ask as many questions or search as hard as you need to until you feel comfortable. This is your choice. No matter the way you go, trust it will be right one for you. You can do this. Like our buddy Ross always says ... it damn sure beats the alternative.

Paul
 
pig and cow envy

pig and cow envy

So glad to hear you're looking at your options for recovery......surgery. :) I didn't get to choose my valve. I have a mechanical valve and have been very surprised at how easy the coumadin routine has been. I thought it would be awful but it's not. I still dream about the tissue valve. If I could have made it ten more years I might have gotten one. Alas, it wasn't meant to be. I AM alive and so far that has been a good thing. :) Some people get a tissue valve and wind up on coumadin anyway. Some people get a tissue valve and end up with redo open heart surgery in eight years or less. Some people get a MECHANICAL valve and have to have the surgery again in a year. The best advice I can give is to make this decision with your physician.....listening to his reasoning in choice. An educated choice is the best choice and you're getting it here in one big cram session. My best wishes and prayers are with you for a great recovery whether you moo, oink, or click!
 
Ross Procedure

Ross Procedure

Thanks Jim and Bob for raising the choice of the Ross Procedure. Because Ross patients are a minority, it's a choice that can be overlooked. Bob, like your detailed overview of the tissue and mechanical, your points about the Ross Procedure are spot on. Thank you so much for your incredible insight and clarity. Where would be without you?!

Cheers,
Yolanda
 
Interesting Point

Interesting Point

CCRN said:
So glad to hear you're looking at your options for recovery......surgery. :) I didn't get to choose my valve. I have a mechanical valve and have been very surprised at how easy the coumadin routine has been. I thought it would be awful but it's not. I still dream about the tissue valve. If I could have made it ten more years I might have gotten one. Alas, it wasn't meant to be. I AM alive and so far that has been a good thing. :) Some people get a tissue valve and wind up on coumadin anyway. Some people get a tissue valve and end up with redo open heart surgery in eight years or less. Some people get a MECHANICAL valve and have to have the surgery again in a year. The best advice I can give is to make this decision with your physician.....listening to his reasoning in choice. An educated choice is the best choice and you're getting it here in one big cram session. My best wishes and prayers are with you for a great recovery whether you moo, oink, or click!

CCRN bring up a point that this forum constantly deals with:
"I have a mechanical valve and have been very surprised at how easy the coumadin routine has been. I thought it would be awful but it's not."

Here is a medical professional who deals with cardiac pts. every day and works around other professsionals who should know and understand ACT.
Based on that experience and in spite of the research she has gained here from Al's site and the personal experience of years of first hand use by many valvers here- she "thought it would be awful". When she actually went on it,
she felt "it was was not." This illustrates a point, that seemed to be constantly repeated. If you want to know about warfarin, ask someone who has actually had years of experience with it. Most( but not all) will tell you " I thought it would be awful but it's not."

Something to think about the next time a new member posts about how they
have "heard" how bad warfarin is, but they never stop to think that how happy they will be when it prevents a future HVR surgery and all the problems that will affect them and their families when they are older and good health becomes more problematic!
 
Dr. Kay

Dr. Kay

RCB said:
DITTO THAT :)

Just saw your thread & see that you had Dr. Kay as your surgeon also.
Are you still in Cleveland & going to SVCH for treatments?
I had the Kay/ suziki mitral valve in 1973, am 59 and doing great.
 
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