Somewhat strange question about hoarding Coumadin...

[almost_hectic]

Okay so please don't think Im off my rocker but while watching a movie recently I began to think about the somewhat recent rise of the doomsday peppers movement. Then my first thought was what would I do if I couldn't get my Coumadin? People store large quantities of food, fuel and other necessities. But can you stockpile Coumadin? Does it have a shelf life? I don't even know how one could even get their hands on more than a normal prescription allows for? I hope I'll never have to find out and it seems like a far out scenario, but it made me wonder...

 

[JulienDu]

Hello amost_hectic

I think this is a great question, there is always a chance for the world to **** up and we need to get ready and anticipate any problems. When you look at our history, it is filled with wars and famines leaving people without proper service for months, years or decades. So if somebody tells you you are off your rocker by watching a movie, he is real *****. You are perfectly right to ask yourself this question.

Like you I have thought about that and Ill share my thought and it would be amazing that everyone shares ideas on how to face that kind of situation. If somebody wants to debate of the reality of the risk of this situation to happen, please start a new topic.

-I was already preparing to face that situation before my surgery when I was drug free. I slowly stock stuffs in two places ( i spend 6 moths at one and 6 months at the other )

-When I was still choosing between mechanical and tissue, many factors came to mind. One of them was to face a domestic war situation where hospital would not be as available and medical supply would be limited. Well, you can stock medicine, you can stock products that boost your INR and with the new generation valve, you can drop your INR much more than before. However you cannot stock surgeons and operation rooms. However you have a higher chance of survival with Tissue if your valve is still in good shape.

-As for stocking the Warfarin I plan on doing so. When you look at the expiration date and shelf life mentioned by the manufacturer this sounds impossible. The U.S army did some interesting study over a period of 15 periods to see how drugs would be affected by a long term storage. Vast majority of them were still fine.

-For prescription, it seems you can order online Coumadin (from the US) without prescription. If somebody can confirm me that.

-Other natural product can help boost your INR and are easy to place in storage : wine, any canned food that boost your INR. Some herbs too. Not an expert on that.

I am sure they are some guy around with good chemistry background and experience on this matter and it would be great that they share their thought.

 

[cldlhd]

Well if we go all 'Mad Max' and you have warfarin but no food that won't work either.

 

[JulienDu]

Well if we go all 'Mad Max' and you have warfarin but no food that won't work either.

That is not the point of this subject, open another thread to tell us about that. You can still eat other human by the way and stock pile food for a long time. Lets focus on the subject and talk about almost_hectic question

 

[dick0236]

You will drive yourselves "nuts" if you start down the list of "what ifs".

BTW, I believe that coumadin/warfarin does have a shelf life. My most recent warfarin Rx was filled on 1/17/16 and to discard if not used by 1/17/17.

 

[cldlhd]

That is not the point of this subject, open another thread to tell us about that. You can still eat other human by the way and stock pile food for a long time. Lets focus on the subject and talk about almost_hectic question

I'm sure it has a shelf life/ half life. Maybe you could eat people who are on warfarin and kill 2 birds with one stone....

 

[JulienDu]

I'm sure it has a shelf life/ half life. Maybe you could eat people who are on warfarin and kill 2 birds with one stone....

Well you would be surprised to know that I have already killed over a dozen Ptarmigans just with little stones. Their meat is red and delicious and, even though it does not have Warfarin in it, they are very low in Vitamin K. So yeah If I'd be naked, without bullets and with a mechanical valve, they would be a very good target for my survival.

Yes, Coumadin has a shelf life like most of the others drugs. Questions go way beyond that. That is why I mentioned a study made by the american army and FDA that has proved that a vast majority of their drug was still intact after 15 years of storage. http://www.health.harvard.edu/stayin...-mean-anything

 

[cldlhd]

I hope you're cooking them before you eat them

 

[JulienDu]

Nah I eat them either raw, cook, or dried up doesn't matter

 

[pellicle]

Hi

Okay so please don't think Im off my rocker but while watching a movie recently I began to think about the somewhat recent rise of the doomsday peppers ... but it made me wonder...

well the issue is that medicines don't suddenly "go off" , their efficacy just starts to fall off. I have spoken with people who's job in was in distributing medicines "past their use by date" to 3rd world hospitals who have no money for the fresh stuff. They do testing of these medicines and that pharma companies are happy with this as then they get real world data instead of 'accelerated aging' tests.

The problem is that over time a 5mg tablet may become more like a 4 ... so dose calculations become more difficult.

I know such things don't concern that "herbal tea" outfit who only use "natural remedies" (which are inherently poor in knowing the actual amounts administered). But for us on warfarin it matters.

The problem I see soon is that we won't be able to properly INR test as before our 12 cubic meter cache of warfarin expires our test strips will be buggered.

My SHTF approach is to keep stock of lots of red wine, canned tomato and curcumin. I think aspirin will help (at least with the hangovers.

I'll sit out the apocaplypse with my wine ... eating kangaroo curries and washing it down with red wine

A previous discussion:
http://www.valvereplacement.org/for...s-you-can-no-longer-obtain-it-what-can-you-do

 

[cldlhd]

I would imagine that a good stockpile of ammunition would help you procure most of what one needs. Maybe even some roast duck....

 

[pellicle]

I would imagine that a good stockpile of ammunition would help you procure most of what one needs. Maybe even some roast duck....

and has better storage life than warfarin too ;-)

 

[pellicle]

Yes, Coumadin has a shelf life like most of the others drugs. Questions go way beyond that. That is why I mentioned a study made by the american army and FDA that has proved that a vast majority of their drug was still intact after 15 years of storage. http://www.health.harvard.edu/stayin...-mean-anything

yes, I also had reported that some medications (from my friend in Africa) were quite good out to that sort of date too.

Storage was important, max temp seemed to be critical.

 

[JulienDu]

Hi


My SHTF approach is to keep stock of lots of red wine, canned tomato and curcumin. I think aspirin will help (at least with the hangovers.

I'll sit out the apocaplypse with my wine ... eating kangaroo curries and washing it down with red wine

HAHAHAHA.. awsome plan

 

[JulienDu]

Hi

The problem I see soon is that we won't be able to properly INR test as before our 12 cubic meter cache of warfarin expires our test strips will be buggered.

Then you go back to dick0236 way , adjust your dose depending on the blood in the urine. We already have a survivor here haha.

 

[dick0236]

Then you go back to dick0236 way , adjust your dose depending on the blood in the urine. We already have a survivor here haha.

Julien, my bad.....didn't mean to imply that we had no INR system (we called it "pro-time") back in the "olden days". There where lab tests available but it was not as accurate as the INR system we have today.
I believe Pellicle's point is that if that type of calamity occurs, warfarin may not be our biggest problem.

I remember keeping a suitcase filled with a few clothes for my wife, kids and me during the Cuban missile crisis (atomic bomb faceoff between US and Soviet Union in early 1960s ??). Wouldn't have done much good but it made me feel better......I guess. We can only hope that a calamity serious enough to disrupt drug supplies, etc. never occurs.

 

[Bushman]

Not directly regarding coumadin but there is a YouTube channel by Patriotnurse and in one of the episodes she discusses the " Big Pharm " companies real test results regarding some medications and its actual shelf life/expiry date. The US military realized how much money they were spending on medicines every year and wanted to know if many of these medicines actually had to be thrown out or if the could still be used. After twisting arms,they were given some information and indeed were surprised to find out that some medicines with a 1 year expiry date was good for 15 years.

I will be stocking up on Coumadin for SHTF scenarios. I'd rather be prepared for a just in case situation than not, especially when you know that there is a specific medicine that you need.

 

[cldlhd]

Ya I imagine in some cases it lasts a lot longer than the expiration date. It could be a case of being overly cautious or maybe it's a case of them wanting to make more money.

 

[JulienDu]

I will be stocking up on Coumadin for SHTF scenarios. I'd rather be prepared for a just in case situation than not, especially when you know that there is a specific medicine that you need.

Same, I'll take pictures of my root cellar when its done.