Possible cause of endocarditis?

[Gail in Ca]

Oops, I just saw my primary care doc and she asked about the endocarditis and if I knew how I got the particularly nasty staph strain that caused it. I said I didn't know, and no one had figured it out yet. She asked about my testing procedures and I admited that I had stopped using the alcohol wipes before poking myself, although I had always thoroughly washed my hands before testing. She said that is how I could've gotten infected, by that initial poke. I guess the alcohol wipe really does take care of lots of germs. She wondered why no one had asked me about this, but figured most don't think about the fact that I test at home.
You can bet I always use the alcohol wipe now that I'm recovering from my 3rd OHS. I will never skimp on this type of thing again! Live and Learn...

 

[skeptic49]

Doesn't take much, does it? Thanks for the informative post, Gail.

Best wishes,

Jim

 

[Maryka]

Sorry to hear that about the alcohol wipes! Gee, my first dental cleaning is coming right up. I sure hope those antibiotic pills I have will work!

 

[Hank]

I was lucky enough to get bacterial endocarditis from a wisdom tooth that I broke while eating pumpkin seeds.

I guess I should be glad though - without those seeds, I would have never met you fine people!

 

[mattwisconsin]

From different nurses I have talked to the benefits of alcohol wipes are debated. Also whether it makes a difference how long you wipe it down and whether you let it dry. With that said I used them excessively while dealing with my endocarditis.

I still don't know where I got mine, but think it may have been from biting my fingernails. I have since quit this habit, but thought I would mention it in case there were people like me 6 months ago not realizing how dangerous this could be for someone in our shoes.

Unfortunately for both of us, it will probably never be certain how we got it and, speaking for myself, has made me much more paranoid about germs.

 

[sue943]

I got mine from having treatment for kidney stones, ESWL - extracorporeal shock wave lithotripsy, sometimes called 'shockwave' treatment. After my second treatment which was more painful than the first and third treatments I bled a lot into my urine and eleven days later I fell ill, which I now know to have been the start of endocarditis. Prior to this I had no cardiac problems of which I am aware.

I now have another kidney stone.

 

[catwoman]

I would think if you washed your hands first with an antibacterial soap, that should be enough.

Alcohol wipes are used before you get an injection because no one is going to wash your arm or your hip or stomach or butt. (That's my uneducated guess.)

 

[Roger Frank]

Anyone know how often endocarditis occurs and is a new valve about the only real cure?

Thanks,

 

[zipper2]

Oops, I just saw my primary care doc and she asked about the endocarditis and if I knew how I got the particularly nasty staph strain that caused it. I said I didn't know, and no one had figured it out yet. She asked about my testing procedures and I admited that I had stopped using the alcohol wipes before poking myself, although I had always thoroughly washed my hands before testing. She said that is how I could've gotten infected, by that initial poke. I guess the alcohol wipe really does take care of lots of germs. She wondered why no one had asked me about this, but figured most don't think about the fact that I test at home.
You can bet I always use the alcohol wipe now that I'm recovering from my 3rd OHS. I will never skimp on this type of thing again! Live and Learn...

Endo is not fun for sure,i don't know how or what caused mine,but it
is a very terrible thing to get, and i was so sick,nothing seemed important
anymore cept getting better from being so very ill.
Think i'm more concious of things around me now and tend to be more parinoid
since my experience of endocarditas than i ever was before.

Dr's always tell me you be careful cus you have 2 valves now and i thought i was careful with 1 valve so makes me bit edgy to think how i got it 1st time.CANT BE TOO CAREFUL FOR SURE!
Thanks Gail for your informative post.

zipper2 (DEB)

 

[Gail in Ca]

Not even a razor??

Not even a razor??

Yikes, I just saw my doc again and she asked if I use a razor for shaving my legs, etc. She also thought that could be risky behavior unless I change it daily! I have an electric shaver, but really, smooth legs can only be gotten with a razor! Fooey! Then she said of course you must never go barefooted outside anymore. Oops to that too. My husband had thought of that one but I tend to forget and just walk outside.
So, not only am I a bit paranoid now, but so is my primary doc and my cardiologist and my husband. Lots of people have my best interests at heart.
I even have my cardio's cell phone # in case I get those symptoms again, especially a fever! Okay, I am more than a bit paranoid, now!

 

[zipper2]

Yikes, I just saw my doc again and she asked if I use a razor for shaving my legs, etc. She also thought that could be risky behavior unless I change it daily! I have an electric shaver, but really, smooth legs can only be gotten with a razor! Fooey! Then she said of course you must never go barefooted outside anymore. Oops to that too. My husband had thought of that one but I tend to forget and just walk outside.
So, not only am I a bit paranoid now, but so is my primary doc and my cardiologist and my husband. Lots of people have my best interests at heart.
I even have my cardio's cell phone # in case I get those symptoms again, especially a fever! Okay, I am more than a bit paranoid, now!

OHHHH barefeet kinda crossed my mind but old habits hard to break,then i too remember to slip my shoes on.
Gail i got all my life drs think i have stupid blood somehow,some way,some where,but i can end up with a boil on my upper leg,lower leg whenever my blood wants to be an idiot and this week it being an idiot and nothing makes me more parinoid than this(THEY DAM HURT) TOO.I'm filling up with antibiotics
I feel this is an ideal way to get endocarditas,if i use anything but electric raszor,i was told in Calgary yet stay away from them for reason of nicks and cuts and only use electric.

Theres so many things we don't really think would cause endo i mean
barefeet a small precise decision to make,wrong decision could cost us dearly.
I watch my temp often when paranoid as now with a painful boil

Since my endo i too have become parinoid and this week real paranoid with boil episode and no doc can seem to find what causes them,my doctor says its the birth control i use and i tend to agree cus i was off the shot 2 years now they are back since i started in april


Well i never want to get that blasted fever either horrible thing to go through and i wonder if anyone knows are some of us (like me)with real weak immune systems prone to get it easier than say someone in better shape immunely?(such a word lol)?
Seems i can pick up any thing quick or am i just an unhealthy paronoid person


zipper2 (DEB)

 

[sue943]

It seems to me to be more a case of 'bad luck' most of the time. Yes I insist on antibiotic cover for dental work BUT for months I had bleeding gums, in fact for probably more than a year, and no endocarditis. Then last year I had bleeding haemorroids, no antibiotic cover and no endocarditis. As a diabetic I prick my finger daily and don't use alcohol wipes and so far no endocarditis.

Getting endocarditis in the way that I did is almost unheard of, not quite but almost. When you consider that until that time I had no cardiac issues so was extremely low risk for endocarditis anyway and to be one of very few recorded cases of it happening as a result of lithotripsy then you will appreciate why I think it is almost a game of chance.

I will take precaution but not get paranoid, IF it happens again then I will recognise the symptoms and get prompt medical attention instead of leaving it several months.

 

[lance]

I'm beginning to think .........................

I'm beginning to think .........................

(bad habit I know) that some patients are more susceptible to bacteria causing endocarditis than others.

and because most members are anticoagulated a skin breaking wound might possibly bleed more washing bacteria out.

Interesting subject.

 

[terodac]

What are the symptoms of bacterial endocarditis? And how can they tell you have it. I have a lot of dental work to be done I am breaking teeth every month it seems like. I just wonder if warafrin makes your teeth weak? I don't want this but I would like to know the symptoms and how long did it last and how long before you knew you had it. Thanks

 

[zipper2]

What are the symptoms of bacterial endocarditis? And how can they tell you have it. I have a lot of dental work to be done I am breaking teeth every month it seems like. I just wonder if warafrin makes your teeth weak? I don't want this but I would like to know the symptoms and how long did it last and how long before you knew you had it. Thanks

I can't answer your questions regarding warfarin making teeth weak.
I will fill you in on my symptoms of endocarditis however:

Around Feb 23rd mine started as a cold and cough,i couldn't get to my doc i was in a murder trial and had no way of leaving through work into 2 days now.

Long story short cough,cold worsened fast.
Started to feel a tempature cus i was soooo cold shivering,but it was slow
process as next day arrived.Cough was worse,now sore throat.

5th day was able to reach my doc by phone and recieved antibiotic without being seen as i couldnot leave this trial....Long story you have to understand my work as security with prisoners,just can't replace,drop and go and i didnot
realise just how sick i was.

In march verdict heard YES i could leave the judge thought i was dying then.
Drove straight to clinic sicker than sick high fever and my Doctor took cultures to reveal anything going on,culture took 24 hrs and i went home and dropped in high fever and was so weak,tired felt almost like rhuematic fever i had at age 16.I just slept and slept and fevered.My Doc called i was immediately hospitalized here then transferred to Calgary where my cardio was at the time.

March 7th cultures in revealed influenza a and staph and the rest is history
it never hit my one valve at that time,the Cardios and other Dr's in Calgary said i was very,very lucky and it was a miracle.
I continued iv antibiotics gentymycin and vancomycin after yet for 8 weeks.

They never really could point where i got the endo from and we never
figured that part out.But did put me through the mill of tests and i ended up almost year off work lost over it.

But this is what my symptoms were like and what happened to me. This happened in 2006 to me

Zipper2 (DEB)

 

[sue943]

What are the symptoms of bacterial endocarditis? And how can they tell you have it. I have a lot of dental work to be done I am breaking teeth every month it seems like. I just wonder if warafrin makes your teeth weak? I don't want this but I would like to know the symptoms and how long did it last and how long before you knew you had it. Thanks

I think mostly we are all different but here is mine...

8th December had a session of lithotripsy to break up a kidney stone and unlike two other session that I had, one before and one after, I bled into my urine a lot and the treatment was more painful but shorter than the others. The lithotriptor had just been recalibrated and I suspect it was not quite correctly adjusted.

Eleven days later I felt very unwell during the night of Sunday/Monday, vomiting and generally feeling so ill. Went to a doctor in the morning to get an injection to stop me vomiting. Went to work the following day feeling dreadful but needed to do some clearing of work before going on holiday the following day, I just did the essential work and then went home. Next day I flew to England on holiday for the Christmas period. Felt very ill the whole time and one day had uncontrollable shaking, the whole time I just couldn't get warm. I couldn't eat, no appetite. I flew back home on 31st December and regained some appetite, I had lost about ten pounds in weight in as many days.

I returned to work in the New year but continued to feel 'vaguely unwell' and as a diet controlled diabetic I tested my blood sugar daily and it was far too high. March 10th I had my normal three monthly check with my doctor and mentioned to him that I might need to consider controlling my diabetes with drugs as my blood sugar was so high so he made a note to take blood tests during my next visit to him and told me to make a morning appointment (it was 6pm) as they can only take bloods in the mornings - this I knew.

The night of 11th/12th March I was vomiting all night and by morning realised that I had suffered a stroke during the night. Admitted to hospital and on the Wednesday got the 'shakes' again and was immediately given an echo when they found that I had endocarditis. It was vegetation which had broken off and travelled to my brrain causing the stroke.

So for me I had an initial illness when I felt very ill, then a few months of feeling vaguely unwell but able to function but with highly elevated blood sugar. Then I think when the vegetation broke off it became more acute once more.

I had no cardiac history and as a result of the endocarditis I lost both my mitral and aortic valves, the mitral was virtually destroyed and the aortic was moderate to severe so they did them at the same time to try to avoid multiple OHSs.

So in future if I feel very ill and feel cold I will certainly visit a doctor as soon as possible. Last summer I began to feel very unwell and as my daughter and family were staying with my I got my son-in-law to drive me to the out of hours GP surgery where I vomited a great deal, the doctor contacted the cardiology team to ask if I ought to be admitted but it was decided to see how I went which was just as well as it turned out to be a cream cake which I had eaten earlier in the day! An expensive cream cake but I think it best to visit the doctor rather than take a risk.

 

[Alistair]

Wow, I always thought of bacterial endocarditis in direct relation to dental work and cleanings and nothing else. I'm going to have to read up on this.

I must admit; I also home test and haphazardly use the alcohol wipes but I do wash my hands with dish soap and warm water (helps the blood flow easier). One thing too, I'm guilty of is changing the lancet needle only after 4 or so pricks. My thought is I'm the only one using it and since I get pricks all the time whilst gardening and what have you, what's the difference? Perhaps I should rethink this.

I just can't get into the mindset of being any more frail than before my surgery.

 

[Lynlw]

Justin was sick for a couple weeks, but it was wierd, so we went to the doc every couple days, first it was a stomach virus, then resp infection then something else, They thought since he was worn down he kept picking up new bugs, the fact we saw a different doc in the practice everytime didn't help. he also would have a day here or there feeling great no temps ect, I finally said this is NOT different things, whateverthis is, he has keeps seeming to get better on the antibiotics but once they stop he gets worse again and demanded bloodwork , so they did lots of bloodwork and we got called the next day he had staph and needed antibiotics, I hung up and started thinking they didn't say where they staph was growing, so called back and asked if it was his blood...yep . "I" called his ped card and said shouldn't he be admitted? , I also got the recomendation of a good ped before he was discharged because I lost all faith in them.

IF it helps a couple years later Justin had Mono and he thought he might have BE again because the mono felt to him alot like how he felt with his BE

ps looking back at timing ect, it was pretty much decided Justin got BE after loosing one of his back baby teeth (he was 11), which is very very rare but Justin tends to be very very rare, So I was nervous when he lost the rest of his teeth, but they didn't want to put him on antibiotics each time, because chances of getting it again that way were much less then the chances of building a resistence even more antibiotics (the staph was resistent to everything but vanco and gento)

 

[Bina]

Wow, I always thought of bacterial endocarditis in direct relation to dental work and cleanings and nothing else. I'm going to have to read up on this.

I must admit; I also home test and haphazardly use the alcohol wipes but I do wash my hands with dish soap and warm water (helps the blood flow easier). One thing too, I'm guilty of is changing the lancet needle only after 4 or so pricks. My thought is I'm the only one using it and since I get pricks all the time whilst gardening and what have you, what's the difference? Perhaps I should rethink this.

I just can't get into the mindset of being any more frail than before my surgery.

Alistair, I only wash my hands with soap and water,
but I would strongly recommend changing the lancet needle every time.
They are inexpensive, and it's just not worth the risk to use a dirty lancet.
(love your avatar)

 

[Nupur]

Here is a different question. Is there a definitive test for endocarditis while it is developing? If you have been feeling unwell with symptoms of a cold that has lingered too long, with or without a fever, could you do a blood test and determine endocarditis? I ask because I've had so much dental work in the last 2 months and have some bleeding in gum, and now I have a cold (cough, headache but no fever) for a week. Having heard all stories, I always worry about endocarditis, but I am sure if I go to my PCP and ask for a test she will laugh it off. When I was first diagnosed, they asked me about having a high fever in the last few years, and then I talked about it with the cardio and she said endocarditis is associated with a high fever and is not like a common cold. However, I hear from people who have had it that they felt unwell for a while without a fever. It's so scary, now everytime I have a cold I get nervous.