Pills, pills, and pills

[FredW]

All my life, i never liked taking pills or having my body invaded with surgery or instruments. Then I faced either OHS or dying.

Then my docs prescribed this medicine for my heart, eye drops so I wouldn't go blind, that pill for my blood pressure, sometime to get my cholesterol in ckeck, and so on.

As i got older, i changed my mind about a few things - like not taking pills and surgery. Then this morning as I was loading up my box of pils, I thought, how did I get from there to here? And I don't even take Coumadin.

I wonnder how many other OHS folks feel about taking a handful of pills daily to keep alive or improve on their quality of life?

 

[dick0236]

The only time I think about my pills is each Sunday when I have to load my pill box. I don't take a lot.....5 Rx and 1 vitamin......and I take 'em all in the AM when I get up. It all starts slowly with one pill....then another.....then for some, like my wife, a handful. Its a sign of modern life and advancing age with or without valve surgery....and I get tickled when some use "don't like taking pills" when making valve choices.

I visit OHS patients in the hospital and I joke with them about the diuretic meds they take to remove fluids from their body. When I was in the hospital they didn't have those new diuretic drugs and I got a 12 oz can of beer each evening to do the same thing....same result......and it was a med that I looked forward to each evening.:coolhank:

 

[Paleowoman]

Hi Fred,

I take a number of pills every day. I’ve always been very careful about what medicines I will take, always. I check each on the health professionals' website where it lists all the indications, the contraindications, side effects, studies done in clinical trials - I check the UK one which is medicines.org.uk and sometimes the particular pharmaceutical company’s own website, and I check the FDA one too as sometimes the US says different things to the UK. I generally don’t take much notice of anecdotal side effects or benefits from forums. I take a great notice of how the medication is affecting me - if I find it is affecting negatively in anyway, or if I am very doubtful of its efficacy for me, after doing my own research, I will discuss it with the relevant doctor and see if we can come up with something else.

I’m very happy with all the pills and potions I take at present as I know they are very helpful for my bones, my vascular system, my lungs and my endocrine system. In addition I’m prescribed some supplements and I buy some additional ones myself - again I take a great deal of notice of research on them and whether I need them.

Three weeks ago I was prescribed a heart medication which immediately gave some negative side effects, one in particular of highly raised blood pressure. I stuck with it a week, just in case a settling in period was needed, and then I contacted my cardiologist and told him what was happening and asked for his advice. He said stop taking it for the moment. I would have been very surprised if he had advised continuing to take it but if he had have I would stop taking it regardless and told him subsequently. I know my body !

It’s been snowing here !

 

[honeybunny]

Guess I haven't thought much about it, Fred. I've taken an antidepressant and anti-anxiety pill for almost 30 years. In the last 10 years or so doctors added medication for cholesterol, GERD, high blood sugar, and underactive thyroid. Post OHS I take a beta blocker. I alsways took a baby aspirin and fish oil for my heart and continue those. I also take vitamin B complex and biotin supplements. Used to take calcium also but didn't like what I was reading in recent studies about the side effects.

it is what it is, I suppose.

 

[pellicle]

We do what we need to stay alive.

When you lose your health and then have to fight to regain it I believe that is a strong lesson.

Compared to surgery taking pills is quite a minor nuisance.

However I feel its a symptom of an aspect of grief that you are experiencing. Somehow the "taking of pills" is strongly associated with aging and while the old guy in the mirror can be ignored it is for some a point which makes them feel old.

In my 20's I was quite conscious of my parents need for pills and like you saw it as an indicator (one of many) that we were "wearing out" and needing more maintenance; more "squirts of Start ya *******" so to speak.

So I think I understand your point. How old are you now? 50? 60? ... and you've made it to here without needing help from "drugs". I'd call that cause for feeling content not malcontent.

I believe that more than anything what we can do is change our view of the world, not change the world. If the view you have is upsetting you then change it. You will no doubt find points in the past (if you review your past if you can) where your attitude between date A and date B (separated by decades) has altered. Perhaps you didn't consciously change it, but it changed. Surely then you can then tinker with your own attitude equally as have it changed by external pressures...

Myself I am in the midst of planning to see if I can take one set of pills off my plate. The three 500mg amoxicillin that I take daily.

To do this I have had to have a PET scan (which resulted in a colonoscopy too), and do an inordinate amount of reading and negotiating. Probably I will remain on the pills for some more months as I have decided I want to return to Finland, where I cant access the pathology tools I need.

It seems insane that I have invested so much energy to "drop three pills a day"

However its actually about something else, its about certainty that what path I am on is actually the best for me.

Many many people take more pills than you, as the saying goes "you can always find someone richer or poorer than you". My army mate has PTSD and familial hypertension, caught ross river fever (which ****** his joints), and has a few other ailments. Managing his pills is far more fraught as they don't want interaction between them.

The other option is to pretend that "living clean" actually means anything or that your body is not right now invaded and home to dozens of species ... and just die a wasting death over a few weeks or months.

Myself I'm a fighter.

I hope you are too.

Take your pills.

 

[pellicle]

Dick,
well my above (if it ever appears) reply was flagged as unapproved ... this site software really took a leap off the cliff back in 2014 and has never emerged. Luckilly I'm persistent.

Its a sign of modern life and advancing age with or without valve surgery.

I'm not sure about the modern life, but the aging yes. The Apothecary has been around since the middle ages and for as long as people have been taking this herb as a tea for that and that ground horn of a beast for this then we've been essentially doing the same thing. So I'd say as long as people have been aging and feeling different to when they were young we've been taking "medicine".

....and I get tickled when some use "don't like taking pills" when making valve choices.

totally ... and I would expect they are so pig headed that when they wind up on (probably even the same) medication two or three years later then I am sure they'll justify this to themselves that they didn't make a wrong or misinformed call ...

 

[FredW]

I suspected my heart valve friends would provide some insight to my thinking. Dick, you did a great job of putting it into words: "..Its a sign of modern life and advancing age..." Yes, the alternative is ugly, i.e. death, which is fairy permanent and not near as much fun as living.

Paleowoman and HB, about half of my daily pills are supplements, which come with a fair amount of research. I have changed my attitude in order to improve the quality of the time I have left. I had to ask myself why suffer or put my health at higher risk to maintain a belief that is based on youth idealism and not experienced wisdom. I do wonder to what extremes I would go to eek out a few more years or months. I saw my sister go through two years of fairly new chemo treatment to buy time. But, I should just put those thoughts on the shelf until they are needed.

Then there is Pellicle, who I dearly love the way he cuts through the fluff and just puts it out there: "If the view you have is upsetting you then change it." These are close to the exact words my mother use to say whenever I use to complain about life being difficult. I'm just turned 74 and her words still resonate with me today. If she were alive today, she would tell me to "Just quite complaining, take your pills, and get on with it!" Pel, my friend, I'm pleased the frustrations we deal with on this site does not drive you away. It is nice to have such a great group of 'friends' that relate and understand you.

I wonder if it is depression that is behind my questioning why I'm taking so many pills. Maybe I need to up my vitamin D for it is getting dark at 4:30 and it is also snowing here too.

I am a still a fighter and will go take my pills now.

Thanks for the understanding, my HV friends.

 

[LondonAndy]

Just counted up my pills as I loaded my daily box, which has 5 compartments for the different times of day I take stuff: 12 prescription items, 6 vitamin type things, and about 4 injections each day (I am an insulin dependent diabetic). I have alarms set to make sure I take them at the right times. The number has steadily gone up, from 1 or 2 per day 20 years ago, and of course significantly went up after the AVR. Generally it is an auto-pilot thing, and if I think about it, it is usually to wonder how something so small has an effect on an over 100kg body.

 

[pellicle]

Hi

glad you're still a fighter...

Then there is Pellicle, who I dearly love the way he cuts through the fluff and just puts it out there:

not everyone likes this ... but its hard to change who I am ... people detect its not genuine and suspect other motives.

I wonder if it is depression that is behind my questioning why I'm taking so many pills.

it might be ... perhaps look into that?

 

[epstns]

Pills? Just another form of snack! I take about 6 prescription meds and probably 6 other over-the-counter pills (aspirin, multi-vitamin, supplements), but the fact that I take them has never bothered me. I guess I'm one of the "modern" folks who just accept this as the new way of managing our health.

I have a sister-in-law who thinks all medications are "poison." She is supposed to take a beta blocker, but often skips it, claiming that it makes her feel bad. I tell her she should discuss this with her doctor, and maybe find a different med that meets the need, but she still calls it poison and resists taking it.

Such short-sightedness bothers me, but it is her life.

Fred - is could be depression that causes you to question your meds, but if I was to be on my way to clinical depression I would want it to be over something more substantive than the number of pills I take. Personally, I think you may be equating the pills with advancing age and mortality, and maybe going down into the dumps over that. Since I cannot do much of anything about that, I choose not to worry about it.

 

[pellicle]

I have a sister-in-law who thinks all medications are "poison." ...
Such short-sightedness bothers me, but it is her life.

There is a name for that game..

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[Zild1936]

i know exactly what you're talking about. pills pills and pills is something i feel as if something about me since i'm always in a need of getting pills and that's why i search for https://medsreviews.com/. for different cases, health conditions and situations. but these pills are definitely nothing good at the more i take the worse i feel, but it feels as if I MUST tae them. and yeah... russian roulette is indeed the name of it.

 

[FredW]

Pills? Just another form of snack....

Fred - is could be depression that causes you to question your meds, but if I was to be on my way to clinical depression I would want it to be over something more substantive than the number of pills I take. Personally, I think you may be equating the pills with advancing age and mortality, and maybe going down into the dumps over that. Since I cannot do much of anything about that, I choose not to worry about it.

Steve, your comment about “advancing age and mortally” may hold some water, be on target, hit the nail on the head, or have merit. It is deserving of some thought and consideration. Thanks for the feedback.

 

[epstns]

Fred - the other fear I have run across in discussions with a good friend is one that usually comes with retirement. IIRC, you are a couple of years older than I (I'm 70), so you may have already been through retirement (or not). When my friend and I discuss our pending retirements, we found that we both fear "loss of relevance." For the whole 27 years I have known this man, we both have been sort of "answer men" in our professions. We are used to having other people need us to help them solve their problems. When we retire, we fear we will no longer be "needed" by all these people, hence we are a bit worried about our future mental states. I'll get through this one, though, as I see it as just the second chapter of "diminished vitality." I have already mourned the physical person I once was, having been quite the cocky, cheeky man in my younger years. As I have aged, I have realized that I shall never again be that "younger" self, and I have accepted it. I have accepted my physical limitations, although I still chafe at them. I think if I continue to follow the US Army slogan to "Be all you can be" then I will optimize my quality of life as I reluctantly slide toward old age. Remember, I am the one who used to define "middle age" as my mother's age. She passed away 14 years ago at the age of 81, still a middle-aged lady. Old age is out there somewhere, but I am not close to it yet. (My wife may disagree, but she isn't here to do so.)

 

[Agian]

There is a place for cocky and cheeky Steve.

 

[epstns]

There is a place for cocky and cheeky Steve.

Oh yes, there is, and I still sneak out there every once in a while. . . ;-)

 

[pellicle]

attitude is important, not just the adjustment of it, but the foundations of it.

Remember, I am the one who used to define "middle age" as my mother's age. She passed away 14 years ago at the age of 81, still a middle-aged lady. Old age is out there somewhere, but I am not close to it yet. (My wife may disagree, but she isn't here to do so.)

I don't think my grandfather had any complex ideas on this, but he knew he was not "middle aged", he knew he was old (when I knew him). He was happy with that.

He enjoyed beating younger men on the local tennis court (which were the gravel type, which he kept as a volunteer grounds keeper back when we had community in what was my town). I believe he was happy to tell them if they played as long as him they would be as cunning. I don't think however that he had any illusions that he was not the man he was when he was 40 (or the middle between birth and 80). His back and injuries from decades of work were something he was aware of (but didn't bitch about it).

He was born in 1903 and passed away in 1996 .. this is him in 1962 shearing a sheep at my Kindy using the old hand shears. I understand he turned up with the sheep in the boot and pulled it out by himself and gave this demo. For anyone ignorant of this, its tough work that requires strength, good grip (on the shears and the sheep) and accuracy.

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he had no illusions that he was what he was when he was young, but equally had no confusing ideas of 'identity' based on a number or on others visions of him. He did what he did and what he could do and was smart enough to know what he couldn't (and ask for help).

A keen tennis player and old farmer ; was as quick to offer a cup of tea and some brownie as tell you you were an idiot.

I miss his sensibility.

Myself I feel I come more from his age than the modern one ... being an IT git I know I'm irrelevant ... always have been ... users don't understand what they use or how they depend on me.

I have long been keen to remind myself that I do not define my self confidence based on my work or my role in my work. For when that is withdrawn (through no fault of your own, because your company goes bust) it hurts and can smack your self confidence. Its a risky business basing the guts of yourself on the whim of another (who isn't even family). I learned back in the crash of the 90's to place my self confidence on who I am,and what I am able to do, not on my position / title / (percieved) respect from my peers. If I can help others then great if not ... well I'm gonna have another coffee and plan to go skiing or hiking.

Know Thy Self (in all honesty), love thyself; for without that love you can not love another.

 

[Agian]

You never cease to amaze me.

 

[epstns]

You know, pellicle, I think I would have liked your gramps. . . a lot. I truly respect people who are at peace with who they are and what they do (or can do). I am trying to model myself after these most dignified men as I age.

I think many (most?) men would like to think that they are "younger" than their chronological age, but the truth is that chronological age is but one of several delimiters of what we call "age." I personally think much more of it is found in one's attitude toward life. If you act like a used-up husk of a man, even at age 30, then by all means, you are used up. If you remain mentally and emotionally vital, then you appear younger than your years. A good bit of this vitality is controllable, and I try my best to continue not to act my age. Most of us, who seem to age gracefully, just manage not to act "old" so we are not perceived as being as old as our birth dates would show. A well-developed sense of humor (humour?) helps this dramatically, hence my latent snarkiness. . .

I also find that another element to seeming to be younger than one's age is that of keeping the company of younger folks. I work with people who range in age from their late 20's through early 60's. If I had to spend my days with only "old" people, I would probably act old myself.

Aging is a fact of life. I prefer to think of it thusly:
Old Age. . . a privilege granted to few, denied to many.

 

[pellicle]

Hi

You know, pellicle, I think I would have liked your gramps. . . a lot

perhaps ... he wasn't big on words (quite the minimalist in communications ... much like Finns). He was of German descent and so I called him "Poppa".

I think many (most?) men would like to think that they are "younger" than their chronological age,

I think that you can change out the word men for "people" ... the cosmetics industry is evidence that women too feel that way.

Myself I am glad we age because it forces upon us the concept of maturation ... altough some people refuse to eat from that plate wishing to remain "19 forever"

As you go on to mention working with younger people is always good. I've resisted management roles all my life and shooting for "technical specialist" because I prefer working with younger folks. Doing so is actually a slight challenge because its tempting to remain juvenile. However that's a mistake. You know when you try to do things physical with younger folk that you aren't young.

There is however (in my view) no reason to pretend to be "acting your age" , performing some sort of "expected role" ... that is something I shun.

but the truth is that chronological age is but one of several delimiters of what we call "age."

On this I agree ... and it is wise to be aware of the reality of this, not in denial of it, and not in mourning for what has passed. Being aware that as you age (feel it or not) your tissue is less pliant, you are more likely to get a ruptured blood vessel ... Age is a key factor in assessing the survivability of a "trauma" (ie road crash). As we age things like "headding" a ball in Soccer become death related (warfarin or not) ... its so well known in the actual studies of this (medicine) that age is a key assessment factor in trauma assessment.

Thus I truly hate the modern denialist view that "age is just a number"

believe it and die early.

Aging is not a sudden process ... however (like watching friends kids grow) the realisation of it may indeed be event coupled ... which is what I feel Fred felt when "pills" frustrated him.

Aging is a fact of life. I prefer to think of it thusly:
Old Age. . . a privilege granted to few, denied to many.

indeed ... I can think of a few who I care about who were denied it ... but then as we age that becomes more likely too

Best Wishes