My 15 yo daugther - soccer dreams on warfarin

[henkac]

Hairline fracture of my elbow. Playing basketball. Took a couple weeks to realize I should have an x-ray done. No bruising. I started to notice a sound when extending my arm as well as loss of mobility. Normal treatment. A cast for a few weeks. No unusual bruising.

Bike chain ran up my shin and left teeth marks from the cogs in a mountain biking mishap. No unusual bleeding. Treated with peroxide. Went camping with some buddies that same weekend. Never sought any special medical treatment for it. It healed.

Broken thumb on a bike accident. This time I was older and one of my kids cut me off. I bailed to avoid hitting them. Just a hand brace. No unusual bruising or lengthy healing time.

Dropped a large cabinet on my foot. Foot turned many beautiful colors. I have a permanent scar on it. But it healed as well.

I haven’t had any serious head injuries that I recall. I did have to manage warfarin through a second open heart surgery. As well as through the removal of my gallbladder and appendix. Typically this meant going off warfarin and taking shots of Lovenox until I was safe to restart warfarin.

But the lack of head injury stories doesn’t answer your questions and if it wasnt an issue for me, it would just be a anecdotal evidence anyway and wouldn't guarantee your daughter’s safety.

And yet you read atricles with text like this:
"The sticking point is if Bosh is able to play, safely, while taking blood thinner medication. Understandably, the Heat are being very cautious. If Bosh were to get cut while taking blood thinners, it's not an exaggeration to say that he could die from blood loss."

From Article: https://www-cbssports-com.cdn.amppr...mann-to-learn-about-playing-with-blood-clots/

If you risk dying from a cut I understand it's not even a question to play contact sport. Even though your injuries weren't head injuries it's still a whole nother world than the "dying from a cut.".

How common are these extensive bleedings one can often read about?

 

[Chuck C]

"The sticking point is if Bosh is able to play, safely, while taking blood thinner medication. Understandably, the Heat are being very cautious. If Bosh were to get cut while taking blood thinners, it's not an exaggeration to say that he could die from blood loss."

Unless he's playing some type of future world dystopian basketball, in which the players have razor blades on their elbows, it is hard to imagine a cut from basketball causing someone to die from blood loss. The more likely true risk would be catching a hard elbow to the head, something which can happen in basketball, and getting an intracranial brain hemorrhage.

https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/diseases/14480-brain-bleed-hemorrhage-intracranial-hemorrhage

 

[Superman]

Unless he's playing some type of future world dystopian basketball, in which the players have razor blades on their elbows, it is hard to imagine a cut from basketball causing someone to die from blood loss.

My Bad Boys Laimbeer, Mahorn, and Rodman had long since retired. Karl Malone’s pointy elbows were out if the league as well. My guess is more likely forced into retirement due to potential liability. “If we let him play and he has an accident, his family sues, insurance doesn’t pay, etc.”. Vs them actual having any meaningful concerns for his well-being.

 

[pellicle]

Bosh were to get cut while taking blood thinners, it's not an exaggeration to say that he could die from blood loss

fear, ignorance and overreaction are everywhere in life.

sadly

also, I would not take CBS sports as a good medical evaluation source

Fears begin with medical caution which grows like a snowball rolling down a hill and then pushed along by drug companies developing alternatives.

Fear is this: Police investigate the death of a man who died of blood loss from a shaving nic

The message is clear

and is best delivered by only speaking in qualitative manners "good, better" not quantitative one (1.5% increase)

 

[Chuck C]

My Bad Boys Laimbeer, Mahorn, and Rodman had long since retired. Karl Malone’s pointy elbows were out if the league as well

I'm going to guess that in your years of playing basketball on warfarin, you avoided rebound battles with 6'10 dudes with pointy elbows.

 

[pellicle]

I'm going to guess that in your years of playing basketball on warfarin, you avoided rebound battles with 6'10 dudes with pointy elbows.

I want this guy on my basket ball team

 

[henkac]

Unless he's playing some type of future world dystopian basketball, in which the players have razor blades on their elbows, it is hard to imagine a cut from basketball causing someone to die from blood loss. The more likely true risk would be catching a hard elbow to the head, something which can happen in basketball, and getting an intracranial brain hemorrhage.

https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/diseases/14480-brain-bleed-hemorrhage-intracranial-hemorrhage

Good link. Thank you.

 

[henkac]

fear, ignorance and overreaction are everywhere in life.

sadly

also, I would not take CBS sports as a good medical evaluation source

Fears begin with medical caution which grows like a snowball rolling down a hill and then pushed along by drug companies developing alternatives.

Fear is this: Police investigate the death of a man who died of blood loss from a shaving nic

The message is clear

and is best delivered by only speaking in qualitative manners "good, better" not quantitative one (1.5% increase)

Wouldn't take any news channel as medical advice at all. But still this is all you know about warfarin untill you start to research it. No wonder people fear it so much. Pro athletes (supermen) can bleed to death by a cut???

 

[henkac]

My Bad Boys Laimbeer, Mahorn, and Rodman had long since retired. Karl Malone’s pointy elbows were out if the league as well. My guess is more likely forced into retirement due to potential liability. “If we let him play and he has an accident, his family sues, insurance doesn’t pay, etc.”. Vs them actual having any meaningful concerns for his well-being.

Sad but probably true...

 

[pellicle]

Pro athletes (supermen) can bleed to death by a cut???

happens all the time ( ;-) )

But still this is all you know about warfarin untill you start to research it.

I wonder if you missed my irony ...

Anyway we all begin our jouney somewhere. What matters is that we do research not seek to confirm our bias.

I just mentioned a similar journey I have made on another post (I'm sure you can find if you seek it).

 

[Woodcutter]

Here's a Bosch article that I thought was "relatively" rational. I recall paying attention to this over the couple of years he was fighting with his employer (NBA) because my personal experience was also with a DVT that moved to the lungs. My recollection is that he played for Toronto before moving to the heat . . . hence the interest from the Toronto audience.

Chris Bosh and blood clots: Five things you should know (statnews.com)

Bottom line was that the employer was simply not going to accept the risk. Not to start a different philosophical debate, but from the employer standpoint, they can replace the employee and there is minimal upside to accepting any risk of this sort . . . no matter the magnitude.

 

[Superman]

I'm going to guess that in your years of playing basketball on warfarin, you avoided rebound battles with 6'10 dudes with pointy elbows.

Anything I did wasn’t even rec league. Malone’s elbows gave Isiah Thomas 40 stitches though.

 

[Chuck C]

Malone’s elbows gave Isiah Thomas 40 stitches

Yup!

Painful to watch:

 

[pellicle]

Bottom line was that the employer was simply not going to accept the risk.

Perfectly reasonable ... and they're probably risk averse (and have no way to really know. There (from their perspective) are plenty of other candidates who can make them as much money.

 

[Superman]

Perfectly reasonable ... and they're probably risk averse (and have no way to really know. There (from their perspective) are plenty of other candidates who can make them as much money.

Not sure about that. Chris Bosh was an all-star, two time NBA champion (played in four Finals). Considered one of Miami’s Big 3 with LeBron James and Dwayne Wade. He was elected to the NBA hall of fame his first year of eligibility.

 

[pellicle]

Not sure about that. Chris Bosh was an all-star, two time NBA champion (played in four Finals).

to my evaluation of the money side of it no matter what the fans may think it seems to me that the industry over all (and in this case the owners of the team) seem to make more money based on how well the team is going vs just one star. Sure there'll be a little bit, but when weighing risks I'd say they know their money business well.

All players ultimately have a use by date.

 

[Gail in Ca]

I remember watching my short, thin daughter play soccer. She loved it and was very fast. She had no health issues, no warfarin, etc. Her high school team went to another city and played girls that were so much bigger and muscular. They couldn’t catch her as she ran with the ball, but they could get close enough to shove her hard from behind and she’d go rolling! It sure gave me another prospective on the safety of the game.
I was glad when that game was over.
I don’t know how being on warfarin would change the injuries. I do know that my cuts bleed longer on warfarin. And bruises I get are often very large. I guess I would rely on the surgeon’s opinion and cardiologist’s too, about playing soccer on warfarin.