Interesting Bit of News Concerning Bill Collections and Hospitals.

[Ross]

Many people have told me that as long as I'm paying something, the hospital can't do anything. Well, those folks are wrong!

When you receive medical services, you sign a paper that indicates you will pay for those services. While most hospitals will try to work with you, it's not uncommon for demands to be escalated if the bill is larger or becomes severely past due. Somewhere along the way, consumers began to believe that if they were making ANY payments at all, they were protected. This couldn't be further from the truth.

While the hospital isn't going to send your payments back, and it does show good intentions, they are under no obligation to accept a long term payment arrangement. Also, it does NOT protect you from further recourse the hospital may have, should they decide to proceed to protect their interest. If the bill is large enough, they can & will turn it over for collections or to a collection attorney for suit.

My suggestion is to contact the supervisor at the hospital and try to work out an amicable arrangement. This means payments that YOU AND THE HOSPITAL agree on.

To answer your last question, most hospitals have escalated their efforts because people take too long to pay. If you have a large bill, as you indicate, and you have paid only $100 toward it ($50 per month), how long would this stretch the debt out to? Months, years, or longer? Ordinarily, they would rather you set up financing with a bank if you need longer terms.

This is all completely legal, as long as they abide by Federal Law governing collections. This law is called the FDCPA (Fair Debt Collection Practices Act). They are governed and regulated by the Federal Government, and a most of them don't violate these laws, as penalties and fines can be steep.

 

[Mary]

So what will they do to collect the debt?
They can take you to civil court and get a judgment against you. Ok, then how are they going to make you pay it? They can't garnish your wages Ross, since you don't have any. They might be able to garnish some of Lyn's pay, but I think they are obligated to use a formula to determine the amount that would be. They might not come out better than $50 a month. You know that they can't take your house, so that's not an issue.

Tell them you'll pay $60 a month and see what they say. When you signed the original document stating you would pay the bill, it didn't state how promptly you would be able to pay it. I bet they'll take the $60.

 

[Ross]

Well right now, they want $129 a month and will not budge on that figure. I'm going to write to the hospital administrator and set forth the facts concerning our situation and see if this hospital has any heart at all. Best thing yet, they asked me to take a loan out to repay. How the hell do I pay for a loan if I can't afford to pay them $129 a month? Plus I still have the Urologist and Radiology to pay too!

Sorry, my head is spinning here. First of the year, increase in Medicare premiums, Medicare HMO increase, increase in property taxes, fuel oil going through the ceiling..........

While their sliding fee scale program cut the bill by 60%, it still does not take into consideration the living circumstances we are in. We are already paying out more then we are depositing. My $32 increase is way beyond gone and it's not even the first of the year!

Lesson learned here---Don't get sick in America without health insurance.

 

[Shine_on_Syd]

I work in a Catholic community hospital. We write off bills for anyone at the designated poverty level. We provide a free community medical clinic and care received in the hospital is free to any employee.
Our mission is more geared to providing medical care to as many people as possible rather than the profit motive.

 

[Mary]

Well right now, they want $129 a month and will not budge on that figure. I'm going to write to the hospital administrator and set forth the facts concerning our situation and see if this hospital has any heart at all. Best thing yet, they asked me to take a loan out to repay. How the hell do I pay for a loan if I can't afford to pay them $129 a month? Plus I still have the Urologist and Radiology to pay too!

Concerning the bank loan, tell them the bank won't lend you the money. Tell them their actions might force you into bankruptcy; under the new law you would have to pay the debt back, but at a lower amount than what they currently are asking for. I doubt that the hospital wants to see that happen.
I would be more concerned about the urology and radiology people chasing you around than the hospital. The hospital can absorb the cost, the others probably won't. You'll have to use the same arguments with them too, but you don't have a choice in this situation--remember that.

 

[Mary]

I work in a Catholic community hospital. We write off bills for anyone at the designated poverty level. We provide a free community medical clinic and care received in the hospital is free to any employee.
Our mission is more geared to providing medical care to as many people as possible rather than the profit motive.

What a wonderful idea! You're blessed to work there James.

 

[Ross]

We have an HCAP program that does that too, but let me show you something here.

Lets take minimum wage 5.15 an hour x 40 hours a week 206 times 52 weeks= 10,712. Ok, now lets put that perspective to pratical use and tell me where someone making simple minimum wage full time would qualify for free help? You won't and can't. You'd have to be working part time at minimum wage to qualify or on welfare.

Now Lyns income and my S.S. Disability (Oh yes, were married, so it has to be combined! Gross Income, they don't use Net) combined puts us at 150% of poverty level, just out of range of most all types of assistance, but yet, not enough to do much with but survive. Certainly not fixing my house, not taking trips, just basic living expenses being met. This is what we are up against. Were not even eligible for help with fuel oil this winter because the same scale is used as here.

 

[Lynlw]

So what will they do to collect the debt?
They can take you to civil court and get a judgment against you. Ok, then how are they going to make you pay it? They can't garnish your wages Ross, since you don't have any. They might be able to garnish some of Lyn's pay, but I think they are obligated to use a formula to determine the amount that would be. They might not come out better than $50 a month. You know that they can't take your house, so that's not an issue.

Tell them you'll pay $60 a month and see what they say. When you signed the original document stating you would pay the bill, it didn't state how promptly you would be able to pay it. I bet they'll take the $60.

sometimes, which is even more of a problem, is they won't treat you any more until the bill is paid, that would be the worry to me, Lyn

 

[Ross]

sometimes, which is even more of a problem, is they won't treat you any more until the bill is paid, that would be the worry to me, Lyn

Exactly, we don't know what her kidney is going to do in the future, it may still have to come out sometime down the road. Were trying to figure out how to afford health insurance for her when open enrollment rolls around in January and with all this going on, it's not possible.

I just know someone in the crowd is thinking, "Well yeah, but that guy has cable internet" well let me tell you something, it's the only luxury item we have, there is nothing else, no cell phones, no pagers, no frills period!

I'm venting here, so please don't think I'm making insinuations, but I do think everyone should see what this is all about. It could be you one of these days.

 

[dmoses1]

. . . I just know someone in the crowd is thinking, "Well yeah, but that guy has cable internet" well let me tell you something, it's the only luxury item we have, there is nothing else, no cell phones, no pagers, no frills period! . . .

Cable T. V. can make the difference between Sanity and Suicide!!!!

 

[Mary]

sometimes, which is even more of a problem, is they won't treat you any more until the bill is paid, that would be the worry to me, Lyn

The hospital, through ER, has to treat you if you show up at their door unless there's another facility that they can ship you off too. That's the reason so many people with no insurance use the emergency room.

Yes, the urologist can refuse further treatment. No, I doubt that the radiologist can. That bill for services is usually generated inside the hospital without their knowing the identity of the patient.

Somehow Ross you will have to have to get Lyn in that open enrollment. That is more important than this other.

 

[Karlynn]

It sounds like that, when all is said and done, your main concern is getting someone to treat you and Lyn in the future. If they can't get blood from a stone, and they can't take your house, then its sounds like the main issue is future medical treatment.

I'm guessing that if they were to take you to court for payment, I would hope a judge would only need to look at your finances and see that you are making a good-faith effort to repay the bills. These medical people most likely have many people who aren't paying at all. Tell them to calculate how much it's costing them to send their bill collectors and lawyers after you, subtract that from what you are paying and demonstrate that they'd be money ahead to just take what you are offering to pay down the bill. Right now they are just following their ABC plan of "Gettin' Our Money". They use it for everyone, those who are attempting to pay and those who throw the bills in the trash. As people have mentioned, hospitals and drs know that they will be writing off some loss. One would hope that at some point in time they begin to appreciate the fact that you are not a throw-bills-in-trash person.

So future medical care. What does the state of Ohio have to say about medical treatment for those who can't pay? No one can be refused medical treatment, the question is quality and amount. It's a horrible situation to be in.

This really confuses me. The government is actually advertising for people to apply for food stamps because there is so much in the account that they won't get next year if it's not used, and people are scraping to pay medical bills. How about letting people pay their medical bills with the food stamps.

 

[Karlynn]

Cable internet costs less than gas you'd have to be buying if you were able to work outside the home.

 

[Ross]

One thing that disturbs me is the fact that they combine my disability income with her working earnings. It would be fine if we were both disabled or both on social security and over 65, but none of the laws were written with this concept that one spouse is disabled and the other working. Any good created by any program is demolished with figuring things this way. It's just not a scenario that was thought about apparently.

 

[Phyllis]

Ross,
Is there any legal aid office available in your area? Perhaps a letter to the hospital from a lawyer would be of help at this point.

 

[Nancy]

Is there any free legal service available where you are? You are getting sucked into some kind of vortex and you need extrication-fast.

 

[Ross]

Free, not to us, we make too much money! I am going to consult an attorney and yes, pay for it, but the fears of bankruptcy appear to be the only way to go.

 

[Lynlw]

yes the ER will take you but the "routine" follow up care won't, so for long term issues, you wont get the care you need. The OTHER problem w/ just let thm take you to court, is if you owe the money they WILL win and then not only will you have to pay the bill, but then you probably will also have to pay for all the court cost, Lyn

 

[Lynlw]

I'm not sure if the new bankrupcty laws kicked in yet or at the end of the month, but I would check incase you have to file fast before the harder laws, Lyn

 

[Kate]

I'm very sorry for your situation - it just isn't right in the wealthiest country in the world that people should have to consider bankruptcy to get out from under their medical bills.

However, since this is the world we live in, my understanding of the new harsher bankruptcy laws is that they primarily affect people living at or above the average income for their state of residence, which I am pretty sure is higher than 150% of poverty in Ohio.

I know this isn't great news - no one wants to have to go this route, but it is an option and this is exactly the kind of situation that bankruptcy is meant for - normal people doing their best but faced with unpayable bills through no fault of their own. Take care, Kate