cooked vs. Raw vegetables

[brendamarlene]

Is there any difference in the Vitamin K in cooked vs. raw veggies. For example, spinach and broccoli come to mind.

If so, is there a difference in the way the veggies are cooked or length of time cooked? For example, steamed, stir-fried, boiled in soup, baked in a casserole???

 

[geebee]

Brenda,

Take a look at the following list. I think it will help with your questions.

http://www.nutritiondata.com/foods-000104000000000000000-w.html

 

[Ross]

Yes there is, but the short answer is that there is very little difference and not worth worrying about. Be consistent in the amounts daily, dose the diet. Don't succumb to the silly belief of using charts, varying cooking methods, or just plain not eating what you want. Eat what you want, adjust the dose to your diet and that is that.

 

[brendamarlene]

Thanks, I have printed out the guide. But I will try to just eat normally. Me? Normal?

 

[Ross]

Thanks, I have printed out the guide. But I will try to just eat normally. Me? Normal?

Sweety none of us do, but we try too as best we can!

 

[Blanche]

A while back I had an article that discussed vitamin K and cooking, but now, I just can't find it. Sorry. As I recall, the article stated that because Vitamin K is a fat-soluble vitamin it is not damaged by heat. Thus, the potency of Vitamin K in a food would not be changed to any degree by cooking. I do know that there has been discussion about sunlight degrading the Vitamin K content of cooking oils, such as olive oil. I did find an article that mentions cooking and has some other information that I think is interesting. You can find it here. http://www.whmc.af.mil/coumadin/coumdiet.htm

Hope this is some help to you. Should I stumble on the other article, I will send it later.

Regards,
Blanche

 

[brendamarlene]

Gina, thanks again for the guide. According to the list, there seems to be some small difference between raw and cooked. Now I just have to figure out how much is 100 g of a food!

One of the weirdest is spinach, frozen, unprepared at 377.1 vs.
spinach, frozen, boiled at 540.8,
so in this case the cooking increases the vitamin K???

I am concerned since my INR was only 1.4 this morning.

 

[geebee]

I would be concerned about 1.4 also. It is obvious that they brought you down way too fast.

You should not, in and of itself, alter your eating patterns because you are on Coumadin. However, there are times when your INR is too high or too low that you can watch what you eat. For example, if my INR (and I test weekly at home) is a little high, I will enjoy a large spinach salad to help bring it down a little. On the other end, if my INR is too low, I will not eat food with a high Vit. K content until it is back in range. Those choices are a little different from avoiding Vit. K foods totally.

Have you communicated with your doctor to get your INR back up? 1.4 is WAY too low to be safe.

 

[Ross]

Gina, thanks again for the guide. According to the list, there seems to be some small difference between raw and cooked. Now I just have to figure out how much is 100 g of a food!

One of the weirdest is spinach, frozen, unprepared at 377.1 vs.
spinach, frozen, boiled at 540.8,
so in this case the cooking increases the vitamin K???

I am concerned since my INR was only 1.4 this morning.

I'm telling you for your own good, trying to do this is going to set the stage for much unhappiness and seesawing of your INR. Dose your normal everyday diet, DO NOT DIET THE DOSE YOUR ON. I cannot say it enough. I get the distinct feeling someone has pumped you full of DO NOT GREENS as so many of these misguided folks do. Your going to drive yourself nuts with measuring and trying to be what you think is consistent to no avail. It has not worked for anyone I know.

Another thought just crossed my mind, are you eating nutritional bars or drinking those type of things? They are loaded with undisclosed amounts of Vit K. These include things such as Carnation Instant Breakfasts, Ensure, Boost, many of the supplemental food bars etc.

 

[brendamarlene]

No bars at all---of any kind.

But just read the coumadin circular and the specific antibiotic I am on actually LOWERS the INR---I only have a few more days to be on that so we will see what happens when it is finished

 

[Ross]

Lets get a baseline of where you are. What dosage were you taking when your last test was done?

 

[brendamarlene]

Today (monday) the reading was 1.5

I had been taking 2 1/2 mg-Wed, Thurs, & Fri nights

But Sat night I took 5 mg since my reading was 1.6

Sun night I took 3 mg

Hopefully, being off the digoxicilin will raise my numbers

Called my numbers into my doctor today. He said just stay at my current dosage (?) & test again in 10 days.

Having the tester at home, we tend to test everyday (almost)

 

[Ross]

What are you supposed to be taking on all 7 days?

That's 15.5mg for the week minus 8mg because that shouldn't show up until tomorrow, so that's only 7.5 mg for the week? Your barely anticoagulated at all and they want you to stay at the same dose for another 10 days? Me thinks you need to find someone that knows how to manage your Coumadin.

When do you or have you already stopped the Digoxin?

At the current rate plus 20% that would put you at 2.5mg per day and then I bet you'd be struggling to see 2.2.

 

[brendamarlene]

OK, here's my long coumadin history:

Feb 24-(in hosp) 5mg
Feb 25- 5mg
Feb 26 -5mg
Feb 27-5 mg
Feb 28 -tested, was over 8, took 2 mg Vitamin K, NO coumadin
Mar 1- 2 1/2 mg
Mar 2- 2 1/2 mg
Mar 3 - 2 1/2 mg
Mar 4- 2 1/2 mg- tested, was 1.6
Mar 5 - 5 mg
Mar 6 - 3 mg
Mar 7 - tested, was 1.5---last dose of dicoxicillin (yea!!!)---getting ready to take nightly dose of coumadin, my new friend (?)

TRYING to eat NORMALLY...

 

[Ross]

It could be slow rising from the Vit k I guess, but I wouldn't think it would be this far out. The dose you took Sat and Sun should start showing up tomorrow and wednesday, so may be check it wednesday and see where your at.

 

[Guest]

Did we know about the dicloxacillin before?

This is a drug that makes management of warfarin very difficult, and in my opinion dangerous. It doesn't mean that you can't use it, but the person managing your warfarin has to be very skilled in its management or you will be in trouble. You will need very close monitoring of your INR for up to a month because this interaction has a very slow offset. look at my page http://warfarinfo.com/dicloxacillin.htm

You do not have a long Coumadin history. The pattern you describe is not very rational. I can't imagine having someone with an INR greater than 8 and giving them vitamin K and then having them start on 50% less warfarin without even retesting in 48 hours. Your warfarin doses look like they are being decided by a random number generator. You need big time help with this. Look at www.acforum.org and click on clinic locations to see if there is a clinic near you that has some skill in this.

 

[brendamarlene]

Thank you. I will call the clinic in Jacksonville today.

 

[brendamarlene]

Just home tested-was 1.2!!!

 

[Guest]

With dicloxacillin and a new valve, and an INR this low, you should be on Lovenox today. Onme of the good things that could happen to you is that you wreck the valve. If that is good, you can imagine the rest. You need help immediately.

 

[Ross]

I think you 8.0 was a bogus test and you should be back at that dose. As Al said, you are in danger now and your issue needs addressed NOW!