Statins Debate

[alan_delac]

In a few weeks my doctor would like to discuss with me taking statins to extend life of my tissue valve.

I couldn?t find too much on this topic. The link below claims research showing that statins delay valve replacement reoperation.

http://www.italheartj.org/pdf_files/20040051.pdf

My cholesterol is usually just right and I wonder what will happen if I start taking statins. Should I try and if there are no side effects just continue or are there some more sinister sides to statins like big damage no warning?

What do you think?

Are there any other ways to slow down calcification of valves? Like a particular lifestyle or diet?

Alan

 

[brd]

Statins

Statins

In a few weeks my doctor would like to discuss with me taking statins to extend life of my tissue valve.

I couldn?t find too much on this topic. The link below claims research showing that statins delay valve replacement reoperation.

http://www.italheartj.org/pdf_files/20040051.pdf

My cholesterol is usually just right and I wonder what will happen if I start taking statins. Should I try and if there are no side effects just continue or are there some more sinister sides to statins like big damage no warning?

What do you think?

Are there any other ways to slow down calcification of valves? Like a particular lifestyle or diet?

Alan

Alan, Dr Sarano a cardiologist at the Mayo Clinic is, I believe, the individual who has studied the role of statins in valve disease. His research was published in the New England Journal of Medicine within the past three years. If you would like I can try to find the exact date for you. I am being followed at Mass General for aortic stenosis and will have surgery probably within 6 mos. I was put on Lipitor two years ago (my cholesterol was only 187) in the hope that is would slow down the calcification around my valve. I have had no side effects from the drug (my cholesterol is now 130 and my other lipids are good too). I fully expect they will keep me on the statin post tissue valve replacement. Let me know if you want the exact reference on that NEJM article. brd

 

[Phyllis]

Alan,
There are quite a few posts on this subject. One of the threads is: http://valvereplacement.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9877&highlight=statins
If you put "statins" in search, you will find many more.

 

[Yaps]

And just my experience's with statins....
http://www.valvereplacement.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10455&highlight=calling+lipitor+users

 

[tobagotwo]

Frankly, the study is not convincing. It has only 22 subjects treated with statins, and while he states that there was no difference between the groups besides the statin use, he then goes on to say that the 22 were hypercholestemic compared to the control group. We don't know what other factors were present. There was no double-blind involved. There was no discussion of relative ages of the groups, or whether there was different treatment in other ways of those patients. In fact, as it is a paper study, just taken from records based on who had two echocardiograms a year, it invites biases based on why the subjects were getting two echoes each year. The study was originally based on a statement that hypercholestemia can be a causative factor in calcification of bioprostheses.

The FDA does not allow statin manufacturers to market their products for this purpose, because they have not proven that their products have any beneficial effect. If the manufacturers could prove it, they certainly would have.

Statins are drugs, not vitamins, and they have side effects. Any drug that requires that you be tested for liver damage should be considered carefully, especially if you do not have the disorder it was created and approved to treat.

Best wishes,

 

[Karlynn]

I recently heard on the news that they are now beginning to link statins with a decreased chance for cancer, but that the study hasn't been completed. It has something to do with how statins keep cells from changing. They were careful to say that people shouldn't start taking statins who don't have cholesterol issues, but that for those that do take it, there MAY be an added benefit.

 

[Wise]

Alan: While I know that it is not the case for everyone, I have fared well on statins. I take Zocor and Tricor; my cholesterol and triglycerides are maintained in normal ranges. I haven't had any liver problems yet nor have I had any side effects. My cardiologist has told me due to my past high cholesterol/triglycerides and my family history, he will never suggest that I discontinue the drugs. However he has been insistent that I inform him the minute I have unusual muscle pain; so far so good. So, just from my experience with statins, I believe, that at least on a limited basis, they are good drugs. In my case I hope that I continue to not have any side effects and tolerate them as well as I do now. Of course, the minute I realize that I'm heading toward a liver problem or muscle issues, I will discontinue. So, best of luck with your decided course of action, Alan. Also, hope you continue to do well in your recovery.

Wise

 

[Mary]

I recently heard on the news that they are now beginning to link statins with a decreased chance for cancer, but that the study hasn't been completed. It has something to do with how statins keep cells from changing. They were careful to say that people shouldn't start taking statins who don't have cholesterol issues, but that for those that do take it, there MAY be an added benefit.

I had a conversation with my girlfriend, TLC55, yesterday about that report. She had been on statins (for a triglyceride reading of over 8,000--yes, 8,000) and had to come off due to muscle pain. We talked about the fact that everytime there is something bad reported about a drug, they manage to publicize a new report that says the meds are good for something else ( colon cancer in this case.)

She's off the statins, but on a different medication and will have her levels checked again July 1. She has made significant improvement (dropped from 8,000+ to 1,200+), but she still has a long way to go.

 

[Yaps]

neruontin is a good example..multiple uses, didnt help me at all, but then dr dx me with torn sciatic, when it was a blocked illeac... neruontin has been in lawsuits as well..

 

[hensylee]

We have had this discussion - several times, but now and then we need to do it again. I took Lipitor for a year or so, muscles really hurt so dr let me off it, but numbers went up in six months and he put me back on it. I eventually could barely walk so I took myself off and regained some of the muscle ability, but not all. Cardio told me there are people who cannot take statins. He put me on Zetia - had numbers checked Saturday, but I don't have the report yet. Zetia is not a statin.

Alan, search VR - for statins - or Lipitor - and you will find out a lot. It might/might not influence you, but it will enlighten you about our experiences.

Best wishes.

 

[tobagotwo]

You don't have high cholesterol like Wise does, so taking an anticholesterol medication would not be the same thing for you.

Statin manufacturers are amazing in their ability to get each new semisubstantiated study onto CNN. But they somehow can never reproduce the results convincingly for the FDA. This is sales by inuendo, having the TV news do for you what you're enjoined by law from doing yourself (marketing a prescription drug for an unapproved indication). I hope and believe there will eventually be an investigation into this.

Statins do seem to benefit people who have high cholesterol, although they are required to have a disclaimer that they don't reduce heart disease (read all the papers that come with it again, next time you pick it up at the drugstore).

I'm not advocating that people who have high cholesterol should go off of statins. I am pointing out what is plain to see, though, regarding their other, unproven and unapproved applications. How nice for the manufacturer that if something does go wrong when their drugs are used for those indications, it's all deniable for them. For those uses, you are their free guinea pig...

Best wishes,

 

[alan_delac]

Thanks for your comments. I chose my tissue valve to avoid medication and side effects and wouldn?t like to take drugs that would cause me some problems unless there is a clear benefit. I?ll try to get my doctor read your comments because his sources of information are so much different.

Alan

 

[hensylee]

If, between you and your doctor, you do decide to take statins, please let us know how you are in about six months. I believe your doctor knows all of this we have talked about because it is finally known that muscles are sometimes affected but not by all users - just some of us. You will keep track of your muscles but if you have trouble, come back and talk about it. What we learn here, we pass on to others, as you know.

 

[Rich]

I have to ditto what Bob H has said.
For high cholesterol they work well for some.
For others like my wife they are a total nightmare.
She currently takes Zetia and Tricor in place of any statins, and beleive me she has tried all of them with the same bad effects.
Sometimes it strikes me that these tests and studies are about one thing.
That is a way to sell a lot more pills and rake in more billions.

 

[ALCapshaw2]

Rich -

What kind of reactions did your wife have to Statins?

Please tell us more about Zetia and Tricor.
What type of drugs are they?
What do they do to help lower cholesterol?

'Al Capshaw'

 

[hensylee]

Zetia is supposed to be a cholesterol lowering drug but isn't a statin. I thought Precor was a statin, but I know Rich's wife has trouble with them. Rich, what is Precor?

Rich, I also take Zetia. Every month after I fill my prescription, I get a letter from my pharmacy, mailed out via Zetia, when it's time to refill the rx. Just think what that must cost if they do it to every user! Does your wife get one, too? Just adds more cost to our rx. I get no other reminders from any other company to refill. Like we are saying - the bottom line - $$$$.

 

[Mary]

My husband has taken Tricor for four or five years. It works to reduce triglycerides, and it has done an admirable job for him. At one time, his triglyceride number hovered around 800. Now it is 60-70.
It's expensive, but well worth it.

My friend has just started on it. As I posted previously, her level was 8,000 before she started the Tricor (they rose to that level after she had to stop taking the statins).
They dropped to around 1200 after two months on the Tricor, and she will be rechecked July 1 to see what the new numbers are.

 

[Rich]

Al,
My wife is the kind of person that goes 100 mph all day, every day.
She went through all the usual tests several years ago including a cath.
Her total cholesterol was about 300 and her triglycerides were about 700.
Her problem is strictly genetic, we both ate the same for many years and mine still is about 170.
So they determined she should start taking a statin.
Well the problems started almost immediately.
Her leg muscles were so weak and painful she could hardly stand up let alone do anything else.
It was so severe I though I was losing her right before my eyes.
It really scared the hell out of me.
So she tried every statin that was available at that time, same results with all of them. With that she pitched them in the trash.
Our cardiologist was not happy but sent her to a doctor friend of his who is a cholesterol expert.
He came up with a combination of Zetia and Tricor.
These are cholesterol lowering drugs that are not statins.
They are usually used in conjunction with a statin to help increase the effect.
So far it has helped but not dramatically, her total is down to about 250 and the triglycerides at around 200.
When they started the statins they also insisted she excercise by doing a lot of walking. Well that sure didn't work out.
We do know a lot of people that take statins with no problems at all.
So after being married almost 45 years we don't agree on everything, but one thing we both do agree on is quality of life before quantity of life.

 

[Rich]

Ann, I am not familier with Precor but would like to know more about it.
We are fortunate (so far) with having pretty good prescription coverage.
We mail order for a ninety day supply at a time.
That usually runs about $30.
If General Motors goes belly up than we may have a problem.
But no we don't get that letter about Zetia.

 

[Wise]

Rich, my 80 year old mother-in-law seems to have a genetic disposition toward high cholesterol as well, and she, like your wife, cannot tolerate statins. Same symptoms, but not as severe but pretty bad. I think she'd totally concur with your decision toward quality of life. Thank God I haven't had those problems yet.