Pre surgery Coumadin adjustment

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Sir Goof

Hello there, everyone.
I'm new to this site. Have been lurking here for a couple of weeks. Can't express how helpful and informative I have found
this forum to be.
Well, found out this afternoon that I am headed thru those double doors again...
Card says I will need my 2nd mitral valve
surgery--- repair last time ------ mech valve
(St. Jude) this go 'round. Except, this time I am 4 years into taking coumadin.
I have a chronic irreg heart beat, so have
been on thinner since last surg.
(Sorry to say, it's been only 4 yrs since the first repair! )
Anyway, wanted to know if anyone has
experience/ advice with preparing for surgery and lowering thinner level at same time. Doc didn't say much except
that they would "bring the level down".
Sounds dangerous!!:eek:
 
First and foremost, welcome to this site!

I am confident you will find many of the folks here quite knowledgeable about a variety of issues.

Everyone will feel for you...having to go through a second surgery so quickly. Do you know what happened?

In regards to the coumaden...........trust your doctors. Except in this case, ask questions. Actually in every case. Many folks here have to go off coumaden for short periods of time to have a variety of surgeries etc. performed. I believe that they will put you on a heparin drip......at least immediately after the surgery. But, I am sure others will respond, again with much more knowledge than I have regarding this issue.

Again, welcome!!!!

Marybeth
 
Mornin, Sir. Nice to see you - and welcome. You aren't the first to have to go through this. Probably several will come along to tell you of their second surgery. I wish you well and expect to be talking you right on to the mountaintop. God bless
 
Hello Sir,

Welcome to the VR.com Forum!

I have a several stories to share - and some random thoughts. The subject is near and dear to me. None of my experiences are as severe as a second valve surgery, but hope they help at least a little. I got a little long-winded - sorry about that.

Last year I had skin surgery on my lower arm. My cardio was adamant that he didn't want me off Coumadin for the surgery. The surgeon and cardio talked and compromised. I agreed with the strategy. I skipped two doses prior to surgery. I checked my records - my INR at the time of surgery was 1.7. After reading other posts in this forum (I joined a few months ago - well after this surgery), I find that 1.7 was pretty low and perhaps risky. Well, the surgery was successful and the recover was smooth.

This year I had an inguinal hernia repaired. That's a deeper incision and required a different strategy involving Lovenox. Coumadin takes days to absorb and dissapate. Lovenox is in and out of your body in 12 hours. Again, the surgeon and cardio talked and agreed to a strategy. Again, I bought into the strategy. The process was to stop Coumadin 4 days prior to surgery. I took my INR every day until it dropped out of range (below 2.5). It took 2 days. At that point I started taking Lovenox every twelve hours, taking my last dose 12 hours prior to surgery. Therefore, I was unprotected during the surgery.

The evening of the surgery, I took both Coumadin (regular dose) and Lovenox. I continued Lovenox until my INR reached 2.5. The surgery was a success. The recovery included some internal bleeding and incision bleeding for about a week. Since the incision in on my "bend line", sitting was not a good postion. Sitting aggravated the wound and slowed the recovery due to anticoagulants. You won't have the sissue with sitting.

Lovenox is a shot in the belly that is self administred (inflicted). It's expensive - do you have good insurance?

Two years ago I did the Lovenox routine for a dental crown. I now consider that to be unnecessary and a pain in the butt (belly). When I have some bridge work done next year, I will push real hard not to use Lovenox - just stay on Coumadin. I can try to "engineer" my INR to be at the low end of the range to help out the dentist. We are not talking about bleeding any faster on Coumadin - just taking a little longer to clot.

If I were to have another abdominal suurgery, I would push for the Lovenox routine again. If I were to have another skin surgery, I would tell the surgeon to deal with the slow clotting. Same for the dentist.

When I had my AVR, the Coumadin wasn't started for several days. I suspect that was to allow more healing prior to the anticoagulant.

I was very sensitive to Coumadin right after AVR.. Perhaps you were too. Does your previous history play a role in your initail dose after your next surgery? I don't know, but it's worth a chat wit your docs.

Your's is a mitral valve? As I understand it, your INR range is 2.0 to 3.0 which is lower than my Aortic 2.5-3.5. That may have some bearing on your strategy.

Your surgeon and cardio should be experts in this area. That should give you some comfort.

However, I strongly encourage you to keep asking questions until you are comfortable and confident that you understand what is about to happen. Know the risks of the process, and know the risks of the alterrnative(s). You and the docs will be balancing risks no matter what. Heck, just opening us up at all is a risk, right? If they have trouble with your good questions, keep asking (others if necessary) until you find good answers.

Hope this helps. Again, sorry you have to do this again. Please feel free to post more questions and concerns.
 
First, mitral valve range is usually the highest - generally 2.5 - 3.5 (my doc uses 3 - 4 due to some other coagulation issues).

Secondly - I've had a crown re-done since I had surgery and there was no discussion of going off coumadin for such work - if you're in the same situation again and your dentist insists again, find a new one. For a crown s/he should have you on antibiotics, NOT eliminate coumadin.

Finally, I'm so sorry you have to face this whole ohs again. Four years just isn't a very long time and it would be really tough to gear up again for it. But I think the bogeyman would be different for me the second time - it wouldn't be the surgery so much as the messing around in recovery.

Best of luck to you and hang in here with us.
 
Hello Sir Goof-

Cute name. Welcome to the site. My husband has had 3 valve surgeries, his AVR 26 years ago and two mitral, one for a mechanical implant, and one for a leak fixer-upper.

He's also had two lung surgeries, a pacemaker surgery, and several other surgeries.

There is a whole protocol, and it's very, very specific for how to manage bridge therapy into surgery. Your doctor or surgeon has to give you the full information on how it will be managed. Maybe when you spoke with him, it wasn't time to discuss this issue, but it should come up very, very soon. It's not something that you can figure out for yourself. So if you are not given specific instructions for how to go off Coumadin, and what they will do to protect you while you're off it, you will have to be your own best friend, and bring the subject up. Some people use Lovenox, and some people have to be hospitalized and go on Heparin, and others can just hold doses and get checked prior to surgery.

So ask the questions.

When are you going to be scheduled? et us know and we'll put you on the calendar.
 
Hi Sir Goof,

This past summer I had MVR. I was on coumadin prior to surgery due to atrial fib. I had to stop my coumadin 5 days before surgery. I was admitted the day before surgery to have heparin started.

I know it had to be disappointing to have valve repair and still end up on coumadin but that is what happens sometimes. I hope this surgery goes well for you and you never need more heart surgery.
 
Thanks Everyone

Thanks Everyone

Hello all,
You guys are great. Appreciate all the advice and shared experiences.
At this point I'm in a holding pattern, still
waiting to get surgery date. Will likely
be week after Thanksgiving.
I had been getting some fluid in the lungs, but water pill cleared me up and right now I feel almost "normal"- what ever
that is!

:D
I'll let you know my date as soon a I get
a confirmation. Happy Thanksgiving
everyone.
Sir Goof
 

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