Dr. Davis -- Track Your Plaque

[Nocturne]

I realize that this is only tangentially related to this group's focus, but I have been reading Dr. Davis' book "Track Your Plaque", which outlines the use of coronary calcium scores to measure (and hopefully slow or even stop) the growth of the plaque that causes coronary artery disease.

The book was written 12 years ago, though, and I know that that is a pretty long time ago in the medical field.

Has anyone here ever heard of this book, or any newer research or thoughts that may have presented themselves in the years following its publication?

 

[Paleowoman]

Yes I got his book 8 years ago when I followed his blog. Dr Davis has changed some things since the book came out. He now advocates vitamin K2 to help reverse coronary calcification, and vitamin D3. He is also very critical of wheat and carbs like that as they lead to vascular inflammation which leads to atherosclerosis so his dietary advice has doubtless changed - I somehow doubt he would advise oatmeal as he did in Track Your Plaque ! You need to read his latest books 'Wheat Belly': http://www.amazon.com/Wheat-Belly-Lo...3409430&sr=8-5 and http://www.amazon.com/Wheat-Belly-To...=william+davis I'm not sure of the difference between those two books since I've read neither.

Dr Davis used to have a great blog in which I learned about vitamin K2 and D3 for heart health, but he's now changed to his wheat belly one which doesn't interest me since I'm not overweight nor have altherscolerosis ! Oh, I've not eaten wheat nor any grains nor sugars nor starchy carbs for 9 years now either.

 

[cldlhd]

So now oatmeal is no good!⁉

 

[Paleowoman]

So now oatmeal is no good!⁉

I'm just guessing from Dr Davis's stance on eliminating grains from the diet to help promote heart health. I've now found his new blog and several entries which mention oatmeal which verifies what I thought, this one is rather amusing: http://www.wheatbellyblog.com/2016/03/the-grain-deficiency-syndrome/

 

[LondonAndy]

I can't help but feel that if we took all the (sometimes conflicting) dietary advice, we don't actually live longer. It just feels like it .... ;-)

 

[cldlhd]

Dr. Steven Masley recommends oatmeal in "30 day heart tune up " but who knows? This probably counts as a grain but just got home from work and I'm going to have a Troegs Perpetual IPA ( tasty local brew ) while I do some yard work.

 

[Agian]

Look into some of the work by Dean Ornish and Caldwell Esselstyn. They have had sucess in reversing CAD.
Most of the great civilisations around the world have been carb based. They did studies on immigrants from Asia to America and found that with the change in diet came more plaques.
Then there was the astounding finding from occupied Norway. The nazis invaded and took away their livestock, essentially forcing them to go vegetarian. Guess what? Nazis leave, plaques return.
Heaps of stuff on youtube.

 

[Agian]

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0735109704007168
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlIBGG8V8P4

 

[pellicle]

for what its worth my High Density Lipoproteins are about double the "normal" ... so my total cholesterol is high. However at my last angiogram it was observed that my arteries were in good condition.

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...02934377908749

I'm going to be boring and reiterate my usual views of "eat well, exersize well and you'll be well"

Walking daily and not eating rubbish food.

Bad food:

good food:

I use a Garmin Vivofit ... if anyone wants to "join me" in being a walking buddy (enabled by their website) I'd be happy to be a motivator.

I usually do 10,000 steps a day

 

[Paleowoman]

for what its worth my High Density Lipoproteins are about double the "normal" ... so my total cholesterol is high.

Mine too, my HDL is always around 3.5 (UK numbers), that's 135 US numbers, taking my total very high into the 8's usually, that's over 300 (US). Also my triglycerides are very low which is also good, usually around 0.4 (UK), that's 35 (US). My CT angiogram showed completely clear coronary arteries. Eating that good food above !

 

[Agian]

Mine too, my HDL is always around 3.5 (UK numbers), that's 135 US numbers, taking my total very high into the 8's usually, that's over 300 (US). Also my triglycerides are very low which is also good, usually around 0.4 (UK), that's 35 (US). My CT angiogram showed completely clear coronary arteries. Eating that good food above !

Cool. So what's your LDL, if you don't mind me asking?

 

[Paleowoman]

Cool. So what's your LDL, if you don't mind me asking?

Well first of all you have to bear in mind that LDL is the only part of the lipid profile that is actually not measured as to do so would be very expensive - many people don't realise that. When you have your cholesterol and lipids measured they measure directly only your total cholesterol, your HDL and your triglycerides. LDL cholesterol is calculated using the Friedewald formula from those numbers BUT there are two problems with that. First of all the Friedewald formula is inaccurate if a person has a very low or very high triglyceride number or if they have a very high HDL. Plus there are other sub fractions of lipids which make up the total too which are not referred to. Here's a couple of links about the Friedewald formula: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Low-d...tion_of_LDL_particles_via_cholesterol_content and http://www.clinchem.org/content/18/...74d83bec6a95a3f11f89ee6b&keytype2=tf_ipsecsha And here's a link to a different formula which is better at caculating LDL if you have low triglycerides: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18426324 And a calculator: http://homepages.slingshot.co.nz/~geoff36/LDL_mg.htm Since my triglycerides are low (0.4 in UK, 35 in US) my LDL by the usual lab Friedewald formula is just over 5 (UK) or 193 (US) but with that other formula it's just over 3 (UK) or 116 (US). And then again, there are two types of LDL, one of which is benign and one which is not - normally the type is influenced by the ratio of HDL to trigs, people with low HDL and high trigs have the harmful type, people with high HDL and low trigs have the benign, and indeed, protective type. This is all far more complicated that your regular GP will know !

 

[cldlhd]

for what its worth my High Density Lipoproteins are about double the "normal" ... so my total cholesterol is high. However at my last angiogram it was observed that my arteries were in good condition.

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...02934377908749

I'm going to be boring and reiterate my usual views of "eat well, exersize well and you'll be well"

Walking daily and not eating rubbish food.

Bad food:

good food:

I use a Garmin Vivofit ... if anyone wants to "join me" in being a walking buddy (enabled by their website) I'd be happy to be a motivator.

I usually do 10,000 steps a day

Wait a minute, did I see coffee in the bad picture?

 

[Nocturne]

It's probably soda.

 

[Nocturne]

Great responses guys. I have heard of Ornish, Esselstein, etc. before. Will talk to my cardiologist about all of this in a week or so.

One point, though -- just because you have had a normal stress test, or have normal lipid levels, does NOT guarantee that you do not have atherosclerosis! You can be perfectly fine on both of those and still have serious, dangerous, extensive plaque buildup in your coronary arteries. The ONLY way to know for sure is to get a coronary calcium score test done.

Don't listen to a doc who pooh-poohs the idea because you're "too young" or your lipids are fine or whatever. Two docs told me I didn't need the test, then I pestered them about it after learning about my AS, and lo and behold, I have godawful coronary artery disease for a man my age.

The ONLY way to know for sure if you have heart disease is to check your coronary calcium score. Everything else is just reading tea leaves unless it turns up positive. That plaque is just as dangerous with a normal stress test, lipid levels, etc. as it is if they are out of order.

 

[Paleowoman]

Hi Nocturne - I've had two CT angiograms and at each test they gave me my calcium score too: 0. I've had really high cholesterol, really high HDL and low triglycerides for the past nine years, that's ever since I started eating the kind of food in the 'good food' picture that Pellicle posted above. And my calcium score has always been 0. Make sure your lipid profile is protective, take plenty of exercise, and take vitamin K2 and vitamin D3 just to be sure if you want.

 

[Nocturne]

Good for you, Paleogirl! I hope it stays 0 forever!

Seeing my cardiologist in a week or two and want to talk about fixing those lipids. I'm not even overweight anymore, been exercising and eating those good foods, and still my lipids are crummy. LDL a titch above range (136), HDL a titch below range (39) -- not protective at all. At this point I have to suspect causes other than diet and exercise.

 

[pellicle]

Wait a minute, did I see coffee in the bad picture?

now way ... not on my watch!! Coffee = GOOD beverage

so, out of interest are you often drinking coffee with a straw?

;-)

 

[pellicle]

Hi

...
Don't listen to a doc who pooh-poohs the idea because you're "too young" or your lipids are fine or whatever. Two docs told me I didn't need the test, then I pestered them about it after learning about my AS, and lo and behold, I have godawful coronary artery disease for a man my age.

The ONLY way to know for sure if you have heart disease is to check your coronary calcium score.

agreed ... don't be holding Dr's up in high esteem ... they are busy, they are over worked and they don't know as much as we might like to think they do (same could be said about ourselves as individuals)

If you feel you'd like to know and its just a simple test and you're willing to pay for it : get it done

 

[cldlhd]

now way ... not on my watch!! Coffee = GOOD beverage

so, out of interest are you often drinking coffee with a straw?

;-)

Point taken, just caught a quick glance in the morning and thought maybe it was a stirrer