Covid Vaccines

[pellicle]

Just read it. It does seem that the mRNA vaccines protect well from all known variants but not as well with some.

but a lot better than no vaccination

 

[cldlhd]

but a lot better than no vaccination

No doubt. Not arguing that at all.

 

[pellicle]

No doubt. Not arguing that at all.

just puttin it out there, because some readers will interpret everything in a binary way (not as good = not good)

I found this interesting and as I mentioned it earlier
https://www.pharmaceutical-technology.com/features/covid-19-vaccine-mixing-astrazeneca-pfizer/

 

[pellicle]

also good general reading here
https://www.sydney.edu.au/marie-bas...for-pfizer-the-case-for-astra-zeneca-now.html
such as this point contained within:
"I've had blood clots in the past - isn’t it dangerous for me to have AstraZeneca?"
Blood clotting experts have identified four rare health conditions which preclude people from vaccination with AstraZeneca:

• a previous history of cerebral venous thrombosis
• abdominal vein thrombosis
• heparin induced thrombocytopenia, or
• antiphospholipid antibody syndrome with blood clots

But for all others (excluding pregnant women) there are no pre-existing health conditions for which there is any evidence which should prevent them from having AstraZeneca vaccine.

People with a heart condition, diabetes, a history of DVTs, a history of cancer, and many other chronic or severe conditions, can be reassured that based on real world data from the hundreds of millions of AstraZeneca vaccines administered, they face no additional risks.

There is no evidence that the vaccine impacts fertility.

 

[slipkid]

There is no evidence that the vaccine impacts fertility.

Are they doing a study on that? Because if so, I want to enroll

 

[pellicle]

Are they doing a study on that? Because if so, I want to enroll

I think we need a controlled double blind study (known colloquially as two bags) for this

 

[vitdoc]

have you found or heard of one that isn't?

https://www.infectioncontroltoday.com/view/lambda-variant-of-covid-19-might-be-resistant-to-vaccinesAgain this is early data and speculative but mildly concerning.

 

[pellicle]

Again this is early data and speculative but mildly concerning.

Very interesting. First to read that variant.
It might be just related to this unfortunate situation
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-08...n-outbreak-teacher-vaccination-plea/100358420
Vaccinated, but still caught delta

 

[vitdoc]

Variants are going to continue to surface. Basically they are the viruses that beat the system the best. As long as there is a large reservoir of infected people all over the world these variants will continue. Hopefully if enough people are vaccinated and we don’t get a virus that breaks through the vaccines easily we can get on top of it. But with much of Africa,South America and Asia not vaccinated we have a way to go.
Unfortunately the anti vaxxers are prolonging everyone’s misery.
Every time there is anti vaccine sentiment more people get sick and die.
Nothing is perfect including vaccines but right now they come as close as we have in stopping this scourge.
Politicians, “religious leaders” and others who belittle vaccines in my mind are killing people and should be considered criminal.

 

[Mister_James]

Interesting
I had been reading that the mRNA type vaccines would cover the known mutations.

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-01222-5

The MRNA vaccines teach the body to recognize the spike protein of the virus. If the spike mutates into say a trident. The vaccines will be slow to recognize these "new" variants. Data so faris that this virus mutates very slowly and so the vaccines are still very effective.

 

[Mister_James]

Very interesting. First to read that variant.
It might be just related to this unfortunate situation
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-08...n-outbreak-teacher-vaccination-plea/100358420
Vaccinated, but still caught delta

NOT fully vaccinated.
You need your 2 shots and not only that you need time for your body to unpack the vaccine stuff, sort it out, figure it out. That's one part of the breakthrough infections that folks are not reporting

 

[Michael O]

Ran across this:
DEFINE_ME
I'm pretty weak on some basic bio, but I think the article seems to indicate that you could possibly use T-cell reaction to target imutable portions of SARS, thereby not needing a perfect match to be effective for the variants.

Like lots of difficult problems, it requires incredibly smart people working very hard with immense scientific resources being brought to bear to find a solution.

 

[pellicle]

NOT fully vaccinated.

firstly there is no need to yell NOT at me as for a start I did not write he was FULLY VACCINATED, next I just said it was interesting and you'd have to agree that he was doing the right things.

I don't recall seeing FULLY VACCINATED in the article either.
Next the idea as I understood was that nothing is 100% perfect, but that it was much better to have a significant reduction of full blown cases in the community rather than the 'au naturale' way of getting herd immunity.

https://www.astrazeneca.com/media-c...the-primary-analysis-of-phase-iii-trials.html

3 February 2021 07:00 GMT
​

Increased efficacy with longer inter-dose interval

Protection of over 70% starting after a first dose

First indication of reduction in disease transmission of up to 67%
​

The primary analysis of the Phase III clinical trials from the UK, Brazil and South Africa, published as a preprint in The Lancet confirmed COVID-19 Vaccine AstraZeneca is safe and effective at preventing COVID-19, with no severe cases and no hospitalisations, more than 22 days after the first dose.
Results demonstrated vaccine efficacy of 76% (CI: 59% to 86%) after a first dose, with protection maintained to the second dose. With an inter-dose interval of 12 weeks or more, vaccine efficacy increased to 82% (CI: 63%, 92%).​

He was on the right path however which you seem to ignore in your terse reply.

Perhaps the press in your nation are better. Myself I'm sick of ours.

 

[Mister_James]

Hey Pellicle did not mean to shout just making emphasis.
The more people get vaccinated, the more we will hear about more breakthrough infections however perspective is still important
x infections/ ××× fully vaccinated.
If you are vaccinated, observe social distancing and mask you reduce your risk to infection significantly.

 

[pellicle]

Hi
all good. Its hard to know "who's who" in this post truth world. Not that it matters but:

If you are vaccinated, observe social distancing and mask you reduce your risk to infection significantly.

my original degree area was a science degree in biochemistry / microbology; so yes - agreed

more than that it statistically reduces the duration of the virus in any given host and also the transmissibility of that virus. This is significant also in reducing mutations. However as its now a pandemic I see this is now with us permanently.

and it appears we can thank increased speeds of international travel, the abandoning of quarantine and the opening up of China for this:

https://www.cell.com/current-biology/fulltext/S0960-9822(21)00794-6
Best Wishes

 

[cldlhd]

Hi
all good. Its hard to know "who's who" in this post truth world. Not that it matters but:

my original degree area was a science degree in biochemistry / microbology; so yes - agreed

more than that it statistically reduces the duration of the virus in any given host and also the transmissibility of that virus. This is significant also in reducing mutations. However as its now a pandemic I see this is now with us permanently.

View attachment 888030

and it appears we can thank increased speeds of international travel, the abandoning of quarantine and the opening up of China for this:

https://www.cell.com/current-biology/fulltext/S0960-9822(21)00794-6
Best Wishes

When you were responding to Mr James saying even if you're vaccinated to social distance and mask up and wrote this-"more than that it statistically reduces the duration of the virus in any given host and also the transmissibility of that virus. "- I assume regarding duration of the virus you were saying vaccination accomplishes that not masking up and social distancing?
I agree regarding international travel, hell there's been a few movies showing how a deadly virus could spread around the world quickly I for one have never been to China so I'm innocent....

 

[pellicle]

assume regarding duration of the virus you were saying vaccination accomplishes that not masking up and social distancing?

I was saying all those things

 

[cldlhd]

I was saying all those things

All right, I was just being pedantic. I figured if you were infected wearing a mask isn't going to reduce the duration of your infection but I guess it will reduce the duration of the virus being with us? But I mean as you said I think it's permanent now. I do agree that being vaccinated will, most likely in the vast majority of cases, shorten your duration and severity of infection

 

[almost_hectic]

Careful what you wish for in terms of insurance premiums being dictated too much by choices or circumstances. We’re all in a high risk group and private insurance already has to be forced by law in some circumstances to cover existing conditions.

I don’t want them deciding my congenital defect shouldn’t be covered, or that if I were obese, would I want them deciding not to cover type-2 diabetes if they decide it’s obesity related? Many of us have already had the battle of them not wanting to cover home testing. We ran into a battle of a lack of supply on epi-pens last year and they wouldn’t cover brand (which are crazy expensive). “Sorry there’s no generic supply. Better pay up if you don’t want your child to die from cross-contamination!” Why do we have insurance?

Because if they can insist you either get it or pay more, what else can they apply that same logic to? Don't exercise, pay up? Overweight, pay up? Eat red meat, pay up? Im willing to bet they already have the statistical data to formulate the premium increases.

 

[cldlhd]

Because if they can insist you either get it or pay more, what else can they apply that same logic to? Don't exercise, pay up? Overweight, pay up? Eat red meat, pay up? Im willing to bet they already have the statistical data to formulate the premium increases.

I get that slippery slope argument but we're sort of already there in a way. As you said there are plenty of things they don't want to cover or at least they'll fight it and often if the doctor's office pushes back then they will pay.