2nd valve replacement surgery questions

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lifguud

My 44 year old husband went into a-fib several months ago and after meds and an attempt at cardioversion, he finally had a angiogram. It appears that his cadaveric replacement has calcified quite a bit. What does .64 cm2 really mean for the aortic valve? We knew he would have to have surgery again sometime, but he is so darn healthy, that I guess we thought it wouldn't be for several more years. I have been trying to do some research, but can't find much on the 2nd replacement. The doc here seems to think that St Jude mechanical is the only way to go. I am not sure I can see my big Irish husband giving up his beers with the boys and basketball all at the same time because of the warfarin. I feel like we are floundering about. The local doc can't seem to get back to us and I am wondering how urgent the surgery is. We also have 5 children and so I was hoping he might have the surgery locally just to help with the logistics. I have read just a few threads, but hope some of you might have some advice. Also, my husband has Marfan's, so I am not sure how that plays into a second surgery. Does he have a choice as far as the valve? What hospitals in California do the best work with 2nd valve replacement in a youngish person? Thanks for you input. We need it!
 
Good morning and welcome. :)

Have you considered visiting with the surgeon who performed your husband's first surgery? If he is too distant for another surgery, he could still refer you to a surgeon in your area.

Regarding valve choice, your husband probably faced this issue 10 years ago when he received the cadaver valve. He probably knows better than anyone else what will or won't work for him.

Mary
 
Hi lifguud and welcome. :)

From what I can remember (and hopefully someone with more knowledge on the subject will come along later and confirm or correct me) the normal opening of the aortic valve is somewhere around 3cm2, give or take a bit. When it gets calcified the valve opening gets smaller which means the heart is under a lot of pressure to get blood through the smaller opening. I think the usual recommended size for considering replacing the valve is 0.7cm2. Sorry to be vague, but my boyfriend had regurgitation (where the valve leaks) as well as stenosis (where the valve is blocked/too small) so I'm a little hazy on specifics. All I know is his heart got way too big as a result of pumping so hard for so many years. Fortunately it's back to normal now after his AVR.

As far as getting a mechanical valve, it would perhaps be preferable for the second surgery because of longevity. There are people who have re-ops with tissue valves the second and even third time around, but generally I get the impression a lot of people get tissue the first time with the intention of a mechanical second time around. I don't know how your husband's Marfan's will affect either choice - there is an online forum for Marfan's Syndrome I think, if you Google it it should come up. As far as giving up beer and basketball, yes if he's a heavy drinker it would be necessary to cut down a bit, but you don't need to give up completely. And I wouldn't imagine basketball would really be a problem, unless he engages in a particularly violent form of basketball.

Mary's suggestion to go back to his original surgeon is a good one, if only to get an idea of what his recommendation would be. And if your local doctor keeps giving you the run around, find another one who gives you some answers! (Someone here said a while ago "you're paying their wages" - so if they're not doing their job, get someone who is). I'm in England so can't give any advice on docs/hospitals in your area, sorry.

Hope this helps a bit and more people offer some more advice later.

Gemma.
 
There are many, many misconceptions about how one must live their life on Coumadin. We have members here who are marathon runners and tri-athletes, so I don't see your husband having to give up basketball with his buddies. As far as the beer goes - consistancy is the main issue. An occasional WooHoo night isn't going to hurt him. He just can't do it regularly. It's better to have 1 beer a night, than save up and have 7 on a Saturday.

Many doctors give the impression that life on Coumadin is highly restrictive - it's not. We take our pill once a day - and then live life.
 
The guideline for AVR surgery used by my cardiologist is 0.8 cm sq so it would appear that 'it is time' for your husband to have his failing valve replaced. For repeat surgeries, it is important to find an EXPERIENCED surgeon with a good track record who is familiar with your husbands issues. This may mean expanding your search area to include a MAJOR Heart Hospital that performs similar surgeries on a high volume basis.

The more surgeries one has, the more scar tissue the surgeon must deal with to reach the heart and the risks go up with multiple surgeries. There are a number of good tissue valves available but durability, especially in someone under age 60 is limited, typically 10 to 20 years which would likely mean he would need at least one more surgery in his lifetime for a total of 3. Risk factors for second surgeries are typically quoted in the 5 to 10% range. Risk factors for third surgeries are typically quoted in the 15 to 20% range. We have several three time survivors and maybe even some four timers. The choices are never easy!

Mechanical valves have outstanding durability and should last more than a lifetime from a mechanical point of view. Other factors such as growth on/around the valve may occur but are less common.

Living with Coumadin has become MUCH easier since the development of the INR measuring system. The biggest concern is head injuries that lead to bleeding in the brain. A hard fall with the head hitting the floor could be serious and/or life threatening so head protection is something to discuss with his doctors.

Invasive procedures and other surgeries require going OFF Coumadin with Bridging Therapy (Heparin drip in hospital or Lovenox injections at home) to minimize risk of stroke. Bridging is a nuisance but sure beats the alternative. There are documented cases of debilitating STROKES following removal of Coumadin without Bridging for routine tests and minor surgeries.

One of our members, AL Lodwick, is a certified Anti-Coagulation provider and Coumadin Clinic Director. He as a VERY INFORMATIVE website about managing and living with Coumadin at www.warfarinfo.com

'AL Capshaw'
 
Regarding the statistics for second replacement surgeries and mortality rates, here is the post Afraidofsurgery made in August. The type of valve being replaced (either Aortic or mitral) determines to some extent the risk involved. The authors of this study recognize 11 risk factors for aortic replacement, with 10 main risk factors for mitral.

Patty's post:

I went to see the surgeon who will be doing my valve replacement in a few weeks, and asked him about an increased mortality rate on re-ops. He said (and I assume he meant in his hands, at this hospital) the mortality rates have come down from 5-6% to 2-3%. So, sounds like as conditions for surgery improve, so do the outcomes, at least at major heart surgery centers.

However, most journal articles I read about reoperative risks have information describing all of the most influential risk factors, so it's important to remember that statistics are for patient populations, and only serve as a predictive tool for individuals (that means any statistic quoted may have absolutely nothing to do with your own individual experience). It does seem that previous open heart surgery is a risk factor for subsequent surgical outcomes.

Here's an example:

Ann Thorac Surg. 2004 Jun;77(6):1966-77. Related Articles, Links

Multivariable prediction of in-hospital mortality associated with aortic and mitral valve surgery in Northern New England.
Nowicki ER, Birkmeyer NJ, Weintraub RW, Leavitt BJ, Sanders JH, Dacey LJ, Clough RA, Quinn RD, Charlesworth DC, Sisto DA, Uhlig PN, Olmstead EM, O'Connor GT; Northern New England Cardiovascular Disease Study Group and the Center for Evaluative Clinical Sciences, Dartmouth Medical School.
Dartmouth Medical School, Hanover, New Hampshire 03756, USA.

BACKGROUND: Predicting risk for aortic and mitral valve surgery is important both for informed consent of patients and objective review of surgical outcomes. Development of reliable prediction rules requires large data sets with appropriate risk factors that are available before surgery. METHODS: Data from eight Northern New England Medical Centers in the period January 1991 through December 2001 were analyzed on 8943 heart valve surgery patients aged 30 years and older. There were 5793 cases of aortic valve replacement and 3150 cases of mitral valve surgery (repair or replacement). Logistic regression was used to examine the relationship between risk factors and in-hospital mortality. RESULTS: In the multivariable analysis, 11 variables in the aortic model (older age, lower body surface area, prior cardiac operation, elevated creatinine, prior stroke, New York Heart Association [NYHA] class IV, congestive heart failure [CHF], atrial fibrillation, acuity, year of surgery, and concomitant coronary artery bypass grafting) and 10 variables in the mitral model (female sex, older age, diabetes, coronary artery disease, prior cerebrovascular accident, elevated creatinine, NYHA class IV, CHF, acuity, and valve replacement) remained independent predictors of the outcome. The mathematical models were highly significant predictors of the outcome, in-hospital mortality, and the results are in general agreement with those of others. The area under the receiver operating characteristic curve for the aortic model was 0.75 (95% confidence interval [CI], 0.72 to 0.77), and for the mitral model, 0.79 (95% CI, 0.76 to 0.81). The goodness-of-fit statistic for the aortic model was chi(2) [8 df%] = 11.88, p = 0.157, and for the mitral model it was chi(2) [8 df] = 5.45, p = 0.708. CONCLUSIONS: We present results and methods for use in day-to-day practice to calculate patient-specific in-hospital mortality after aortic and mitral valve surgery, by the logistic equation for each model or a simple scoring system with a look-up table for mortality rate.
 
You know, you guys scare me with your statistics. If everyone were the same, I could see basing decisions on them, but everyone is so different that when it comes to this surgery, you might as well throw all of that out the window. My own surgeon, 2nd surgery said 50/50. That does not fit into these statistics anywhere.

I think what you have to do is find the best possible person to do it, feel in your gut that it's the right decision and then move forth.
 
Don't be scared!

Don't be scared!

Ross,
I was trying to follow the guidelines Hank put forth awhile back about posting sources if you knew where it came from. :)

I think that if you absolutely have to have the surgery, it's useless to wonder about the statistics anyway. But Lifguud asked, so I'm trying to oblige. ;) ;)
 
Thanks so much

Thanks so much

Thanks so much for your thoughts. I sent a copy to my husband and he found it interesting and comforting too. We are still trying to get in to see our local surgeon. Has anyone had avr at Stanford? It is about 3 1/2 hours from us, but probably the closest big center. We spent some time there with one of our daughters, so at least we are familiar with the facility. My husband's original surgery was at Good Sam in LA, but the medical group is no longer doing surgery there I guess. Any other ideas of hospitals or surgeons to talk to in California? Thanks again.
 
lifguud said:
Thanks so much for your thoughts. I sent a copy to my husband and he found it interesting and comforting too. We are still trying to get in to see our local surgeon. Has anyone had avr at Stanford? It is about 3 1/2 hours from us, but probably the closest big center. We spent some time there with one of our daughters, so at least we are familiar with the facility. My husband's original surgery was at Good Sam in LA, but the medical group is no longer doing surgery there I guess. Any other ideas of hospitals or surgeons to talk to in California? Thanks again.

I had my AVR at Stanford a few years back under the watch of Dr. Hanley. Minus the fact that it was open heart surgery the experience was good.
 
More than a few members have had surgery at Cedars Sinai and had Dr. Raisi as their surgeon. Eric (a member) just had his surgery there on September 12.
 
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